Does the show need to change it's format at all?

[BobbyMiller]

Hey guys,

For the most part, everyone's been pretty positive about the show. But, every once in a while someone critiques the show with something along this type of comment:

(Via Youtube:)

kesmeby
"Just a suggestion, but I really think this show would be better if it talked more about the making of, and inspiration for, the short films it's supposed to be promoting and was less about the host. Maybe you could interview some the films creators?"

MarkMikex
"Information about the films would be great, making of and also giving reasons why exactly the films shown are great/ some of the best in the world. The host is quite entertaining and such, but lets boost the intellectual side aswell. Anyone who has made an award winning short film will know they require incredible effort to make"

What do you think?

My original goal of the show was pretty straight forward: Try to be entertaining, while also introducing you to great short films. If you liked them enough to watch them in their entirety, you'd go to our website. Watch them and then talk about them in the forums.

I was hoping that we would save critical discussion of the films to our forums. Something that has been happening already, which I think is really cool.

My response to this critique of the show is that if I were to talk about each short and critique each one...it would be a much longer show and we're looking to keep this about 3-5 minutes each week. And I think to do it justice, I'd have to talk for a few minutes about each film and doing interviews and such would also be a lot of time spent...

So, what do you guys think? Is there a better balance I need to reach?

I try not to take stuff too much to heart about the show, because at the end of the day, some people just won't like it. But, I figured I'd ask!

PS. I've emailed the youtubers above to join this thread in hopes they can talk about what they'd like to see changed as well.

Thanks all
:bobby:

[Alasdair]

wear a silly hat

[TreasureBox Films]

^^ he knows what goin' on.

[Citrus]

I think the format is fine. You entertain. You introduce. And you add a little thing about a moguler who has their film in the show. Which I think mentioning Mogulville members in the video could add to the members in the community via the viewers.

So I say keep the format.

[SolarMoth]

Actually interviewing the people who are selected to be in Best Short Films is a good idea.

You could either call them or maybe just ask a few questions in your blog on the site.

Email them the questions maybe 3-5 and post the responses in the your blog (for the show) the day after (or the same day).

[BobbyMiller]

I think the blog idea could be cool. The problem is, filmmakers are often slow in getting back to us (they have to sign off on release forms for the show) and getting interviews with everyone might be tough, but I think it's worth doing at least in text form.

What do you think of this idea:
What if I found out from the filmmakers a few "fun facts" about the film. For example, "Expiration Date" on episode 3 was made for 30 dollars and no crew. Ie. the intro would be more like (MY SKETCH BIT HERE) and now for expiration date, a film that was made for only 30 dollars with no crew! Just goes to show you, you don't need money to make a great film"

Ie something like that.

[lyhoproductions]

Keep you're parts. They're funny as hell!!

[_ray_biddle_]

Hey guys,

For the most part, everyone's been pretty positive about the show. But, every once in a while someone critiques the show with something along this type of comment:

(Via Youtube:)

kesmeby
"Just a suggestion, but I really think this show would be better if it talked more about the making of, and inspiration for, the short films it's supposed to be promoting and was less about the host. Maybe you could interview some the films creators?"

MarkMikex
"Information about the films would be great, making of and also giving reasons why exactly the films shown are great/ some of the best in the world. The host is quite entertaining and such, but lets boost the intellectual side aswell. Anyone who has made an award winning short film will know they require incredible effort to make"

What do you think?

My original goal of the show was pretty straight forward: Try to be entertaining, while also introducing you to great short films. If you liked them enough to watch them in their entirety, you'd go to our website. Watch them and then talk about them in the forums.

I was hoping that we would save critical discussion of the films to our forums. Something that has been happening already, which I think is really cool.

My response to this critique of the show is that if I were to talk about each short and critique each one...it would be a much longer show and we're looking to keep this about 3-5 minutes each week. And I think to do it justice, I'd have to talk for a few minutes about each film and doing interviews and such would also be a lot of time spent...

So, what do you guys think? Is there a better balance I need to reach?

I try not to take stuff too much to heart about the show, because at the end of the day, some people just won't like it. But, I figured I'd ask!

PS. I've emailed the youtubers above to join this thread in hopes they can talk about what they'd like to see changed as well.

Thanks all
:bobby:

Bobby-
You're original plan sound like the way to go. The behind the scenes stuff should be up to the filmmaker to do.

Once n a while if you find a film that's really special then interview the people behind it.

I like how you do things.

[bigfootfilms]

i would be cool if there were more of the submitted videos, but besides that its great

[TheMightySeamus]

I think it's fine as it is, and the blog idea sounds great.

[anomalie]

Do whatever you want! It's not my show. :D

[bigfootfilms]

and maybe no themes, they're limiting or maybe a theme one using bfx inspired films (like ours!)

[anomalie]

The themes are great!

[kesmeby]

I'm kesmeby and it looks like i started all this trouble. :hayguyz:

I had just about finished composing a long message for this topic when FireFox wigged out on me (aka user error because I'm tired) and I lost it. Which is frustrating and I have to go to bed.

Hopefully I'll get a chance to post something Sunday night.

The Best Short Films Show, as it is now, is good, but I think it has a ton of potential to be even better. So if you're open to them I'd love to bounce a couple of ideas off you.

Thanks for inviting me to the discussion.

[Jonny_McBane]

You should discuss something about the short film. Maybe interview the directors?

[SolarMoth]

The blog idea is nothing fancy. Just email (Instant message, facebook, private message, ect.) a couple questions to the director (or whomever). Post them like so:

1) Any fun facts you'd like to share?
Well, during the scene where the alien decapitated the cyborg captain, you can hear my pet chimp throwing rocks at my sound guy.

2) What was the most difficult scene to shoot?
...

Only 3 questions may only be necessary. If you ask too many, readers lose interest. You'll have a total of 3 per short film and 12 total per episode.

[BobbyMiller]

Wes emailed me about doing the interview and I think he'd be great for the job! I think we're gonna start doing this as an added feature to every episode. We'll see how it goes.

Thanks for the suggestions!

Also. Should we make an official thread for EACH film that comes out? So that when we do this interview blog it can have a link that says, "to discuss the film with other filmmakers click here".

[SolarMoth]

It seems that official threads are made by community members already.

[Dead Iris]

The only problem with adding all this extra crap, is that it would cause the show harder to become harder to make, edit, shoot, etc. After a while, that would get exausting. I think focusing on promoting good short films and showing a moguler one is what it should stay as.

There could be like a little extra thing you do once and a while where you interview one of the filmmaker's on their short. Maybe a once-a-month thing or something.

[WesScog]

Thats why some of this stuff could be outsourced. All of the stuff I do is behind-the-scenes work.

If I do the interviews (like I do regularly on the blog anyway), that's not any extra stress on Bobby.

[tttnemelc84]

honestly i don't think you should do anything differently.....your introducing the 4 shorts and you add a quick little snippit of info when you think it needs it and also you put the creator of every short's website link with the video.....i have an idea bobby tell me what you think set up a forum section for questions for the creators and see if you can set up a schedule where the filmmakers can go on once a week or whenever they can and answer the questions becauseinterviews will take away from the "all by myself" aspect and it will take too long....unless you keep it at 3 questions that the fans post but keep it like the debates and they only have 2 minutes for the 3 questions so they're not babbling and it stays short and sweet.......and make them eat peanut butter sandwiches too for the extra challenge but that's what i would do but that's why i don't have my own show now is it

[SolarMoth]

Thats why some of this stuff could be outsourced. All of the stuff I do is behind-the-scenes work.

If I do the interviews (like I do regularly on the blog anyway), that's not any extra stress on Bobby.


And this doesn't have to be done by the main episode's release. Maybe 2-3 days later. It's like how BFX has two episodes: How2 and Test Film.

[lotrwackjob]

my crit is that you should go into why the films were chosen, and how they were made, seeing as this website is created to make us (the viewers) better film makers. I think Wes should take care of the weekly "film fest" and that the show should be more helpful to people that want to make it on the show. Include more interviews, and more technique. It's just my opinion. thanks

[BobbyMiller]

So, perhaps every introduction I throw in a fact about the film ie. "Made for $40" or a quick sentence or two as to why I think it's great.

Then, Wes can have an interview with the filmmakers (who wish to participate) That could maybe go up Friday or Monday after the show.

We'll also be sure to try and get the filmmakers to visit the forums (something I've been pushing since day one, but not everyone comes to the boards unfortunately.)

How does this sound?

So, no I wouldn't be talking about the films and critiquing them for several minutes at a time, but I would be throwing in a little bit more info as to what the film is and why it was chosen or some type of "fun fact".
:bobby:

[theN]

the only change is more forum members videos but i like it!!!

[tttnemelc84]

So, perhaps every introduction I throw in a fact about the film ie. "Made for $40" or a quick sentence or two as to why I think it's great.

Then, Wes can have an interview with the filmmakers (who wish to participate) That could maybe go up Friday or Monday after the show.

We'll also be sure to try and get the filmmakers to visit the forums (something I've been pushing since day one, but not everyone comes to the boards unfortunately.)

How does this sound?

So, no I wouldn't be talking about the films and critiquing them for several minutes at a time, but I would be throwing in a little bit more info as to what the film is and why it was chosen or some type of "fun fact".
:bobby:


sounds good bobby

[loosechange]

If people are demanding some behind the scenes with the filmmakers don't necessarily turn it down but it put the idea to the side.

Maybe later on you can throw out a bonus episode talking in depth with whatever featured filmmaker.

but your format so far is working smoothly.

[Jakekilgore]

the interviews would be great but its too much time
i think the show is cool, i just wish my short was done so i could submit it

[YawnConnery]

So, perhaps every introduction I throw in a fact about the film ie. "Made for $40" or a quick sentence or two as to why I think it's great.

Yadda , yadda...burrrp...ahhhh.

How does this sound?

So, no I wouldn't be talking about the films and critiquing them for several minutes at a time, but I would be throwing in a little bit more info as to what the film is and why it was chosen or some type of "fun fact".
:bobby:

Sounds good but hey I think the show is Great like it is. Please don't overload yourself. Post a link if the filmmaker gives you one.
Ask yourself these questions:
1. Am I having fun?
2. Am I achieving the goals I want?
3. Is your fan base growing? -Are they having fun?
4. Should I ban Yawn? (Let's skip that one).
5. See number 1.

Outsourcing is a good idea. In the end it's your show and I love it. Don't screw it up...We know where you live.

Yawn of the dead

[BobbyMiller]

SOUNDS GOOD TO ME.

My main goal is to get the people who watch on youtube (which is over 10,000-15,000 a week) to come to the website and participate in the forums.

But, it's hard to win them over!

:bobby:

[WesScog]

I would like to have a series of 5-10 questions that I can ask every filmmakers (along with a hand full of questions that i'll come up with and tailor to each filmmaker, like if they got someone special to work in or on their video i'll ask them how they were introduced to them and convinced them to work on their project. Or why they shot on the medium that they did. Or why they chose their subject matter. etc.)

What are questions that you guys are interested most? Technicals Aspects? Artistic/Creative Aspects? What are you guys wanting to know about the most?

[tttnemelc84]

i like a little of everything but also some random questions which have nothing to do with the subject at all to see how they are on the spot

[WesScog]

Like what would you ask them specifically that you think would be nice "surprise" questions?

[Alasdair]

penis size

[WesScog]

Not a good question. What if we interview some hermaphrodite aliens that lay eggs in spawning ponds and fertilize them like frogs?

[kesmeby]

Hello again. It looks like you are on the right track and I look forward to future episodes. Here's are my suggestions but feel free to disregard them. I'd hoped to post this message several days ago.

My suggestion:
Break the episodes into two parts. In the second segment introduce the short films like you do currently. You may want to reduce the number of shorts introduced per episode to 2 or 3 to save time. In the first segment you can review/interview one of the films/filmmakers from the previous episode.

The delay between episodes will allow forum members to see and discuss the shorts. The best comments and questions on the forum can be passed on to the filmmakers with time for them to respond and sign releases. Since you are introducing 2 or 3 shorts per episode not all of the filmmakers will need to respond and if more do then you have additional content for a rainy day or special episode.

To keep it flexible and efficient you might want to let the filmmakers set their level of participation. You could either read text they send you from an email, or play audio recorded in a phone interview while showing stills from pertinent scenes in the short. If they have the means you could play webcam interview footage. Whatever you can get.

Why I'm making these recommendations:
When I first heard about this show it immediately struck me as a good idea. There are so many awful short films out there it would be great to have some one screening them and steering us toward the good ones. The problem with the show is that I don't get enough of a feel for the shorts to really make me want to see them. I actually haven't watched any of the shorts you've recommended yet--I'll watch Prison Bake shortly.

I know these are shorts but I already waste too much time on the Internet and YouTube without clicking on every referral link I see. If I knew a little more about the shorts in question I would feel more confident that they might be worth watching. Seeing as how Indy Mogul is a filmmaker's resource, I figured interviewing the filmmakers was the most obvious way to get people interested.

I understand doing so would be more work for you, but if the episodes took a little longer to make in order to get more relevant content I think it would be worth it.

Also, if you use the two-part format I recommended your viewers would still be getting the experience they get now just with the added bonus of extending the best of conversation from the forums back into the show. And less involved viewers, like myself, get to experience more of what goes on in the forums between episodes and may draw more people in.

[kesmeby]

Question suggestions:
Time to finish, from idea to final editing
Budget, and fund raising techniques
Casting, where do you get your people
Any special DIY equipment used
Vision, what was the pre-production goal for the films look and feel and was it achieved?
What changes needed to be made from script to shooting
Inspirations and Influences
Any gaffes or mistakes in the final film
Any funny or horrific production stories
What's your next project?I hope that helps.

[lotrwackjob]

personally i like to hear about different struggles they had to overcome when making the movie, or about the artistic part.

[tttnemelc84]

you want a random question.....ok here's one and feel free to answer it if you want.....who would win in a thunderdome style match teddy roosevelt or a grizzly bear with reebok pumps on?.....or how about this why do you think plant cells look like mini jello squares in a microscope.......remember the less it makes sense the better the random question is....that's my philosophy

[tttnemelc84]

also here's a wild idea.....what if bobby and the creator of the short films did their own voice commentary that you can download and listen too while playing the movie....like what kevin smith did for clerks 2 while it was still in theatres and i know it's not original since he did it but i havn't heard anyone doing it since like that and even more so not doing it for short films or at best bobby does his own commentary while it's playing and throws tidbits of info at you while your watching it maybe in a MST3k style but highly doubt that.....because bobby doesn't have robots.....at least as far as i know

[DarkerVisionsMedia]

I posted a comment on episode 4 and
Bobby was good enough to contact me privately and we had a discussion.

My concern was that way the episodes presented the films did not leave me much desire to see the full shorts.
Here are the points that i made during our exchange.

As I said in my post it does not leave me with a desire to watch any of the short films.
I see what you are saying about the time involved, so perhaps an extended crit is not necessary, but instead how about just a couple of words about why a particular short-film is exceptional or more importantly why "YOU" found it exceptional.
That would make someone more excited about checking out these pieces.

That reason may be a bit of technical achievement , a some excellent dialogue, or a story that touched you on a personal level.

For instance if i were to talk up this test film by Andrew Kramer @ video copilot
http://www.videocopilot.net/meteor/watch/
I might talk about how in 90 seconds this 2 man production managed to hit all the points of a Bay/bruckheimer blockbuster with no dialogue.

Or if i were to talk up the last 2 IndyMogul test films I'd point out that each of them is a homage to a particular style of film.
Those being Classic Horror or Kung Fu flick.

So really the actual format of the show is fine just talk up some positive points of the short.

Watching this weeks episode i also think instead of having just random bits of the movie, the film makers themselves can be of more help by providing more interesting short trailers.