Film School?

[Brainstrained]

We have this university thing coming up at our school in a few weeks where we check out different universities and see what sort of grades/prerequisites we need to get into them. I started to think about film school. I've heard so many things about it, bad and good, so I just don't know what to make of it all. What are your experiences with film school? What are good schools? Did the IndyMogul dudes go to film school?

Any help here would really be appreciated.

Thanks guys.

:learn:

[Joshbond]

Well being 14 i've never been but i'm heading off to filmschool myself when i finish high school! :D

If you want film making to be a big part of your life i guess film schools your best shot! ;)

[njfilmcore]

LOL
FILM SKEWL IS LAME
DONT

[KenOchalek]

I went to a four-year public University and majored in Broadcast and Cinematic Arts. It wasn't a true film school, but there were lots of opportunities to get involved in Television productions, be on college radio, and other media-related activities. It was where I discovered and developed my video production skills (the proof is in the pudding, www.youtube.com/KenOchalek (http://www.youtube.com/KenOchalek))

Every school if different, but whatever you do, make sure you working toward a Bachelor's degree. There are a lot of trade schools out there that specialize in filmmaking or other media/entertainment fields (Full Sail is the first that springs to mind).

However, most of these places only offer some kind of "specialist's certificate". True, they are faster programs, so you get into your chosen field more quickly, but say 20 years from now (I know you can't think that far ahead, but just be open to life's weird possibilities), you decide you're sick of the entertainment industry and want to teach high school. You don't even have a Bachelor's degree, let alone a teaching certificate, which means in most cases, you're gonna be going back to school (except you'll be 38 and not 18).

But having a bachelor's degree (no matter what you major in) if and when you move onto to a different field tells employers that you've met a standard for the basics, plus the specialized knowledge from whatever you major in.

[nooneimportant77]

PA- "i studied at NYU for cinematography, and dramatic arts"
Producer- "awesome, go pick up the food"

but seriously it helps.

[Jason Endurance]

I wouldn't suggest it. Waste of money. Don't get me wrong. I went, had a great time, but I didn't learn anything that I didn't stumble upon myself with research.

If possible go volunteer at your local cable company. There are usually one in every community. Just volunteer whenever and where ever you can. Real experience is what pays off in the end.

Plus in this industry, it's not what you know, it's who you know.

[edwardlavender]

I went to Full Sail,

I absolutely loved it. I met some of the best friends I have there.

Sure there are a couple things that should be fixed but hey, that's everywhere.

You don't HAVE to go to film school to make it in this business...but look who has gone to film school.

Steven Spielberg, Martin Scorsese...I really don't need to list anymore names after those two.

Full Sail was cool because it taught you on all the industry standard equipment. I doubt other film schools have the kind of equipment that Full Sail has.

I had a blast at school...but it really is all your decision alone. If you wanna have fun and meet some really cool people who you will collaborate with for a long time, go to film school...think of it as an extra in. Just don't be a dick.

If you wanna just get into the biz you are welcome to. but it is a hard biz to crack into.

I got experience at that school...that's what was good at Full Sail. We had actual days. 10-16 hour days during some classes. It was fun but it showed you what life's really like in the the film biz.

And another thing, I didn't get any "specialists certificate". I have an Associates Degree and Bachelors Degree.

-zac

[WesScog]

In Hollywood it doesn't matter what school you went too, or if you even went to school at all.

It doesn't matter what degree you have, or if you have a degree.

BUT, BUT, you can learn a lot in Film School that you may not learn on your own, and you can be exposed to films that you never would have seen or known about had you not had a Professor to tell you, "This is a good film, and here's why." And it really can help your own voice develop, if you're exposed to these very, unlike you kind of films.

ALSO, it gives you easy access to local talent, you meet actors, writers, cinematographers, sound editors, everyone that wants to be involved in film.

Want to make a movie? Lots of eager people, who would love to work on a film, and are willing to work for Pizza and seeing their name in Credits.

So you don't have to wade through the queries of dubious "professionals" that may or may not want to be payed for perhaps lackluster work.

With college students, you know what kind of stuff they do, because you're in class with them, and 9/10 they aren't going to ask to be paid, they just enjoy working on film, because they're just starting out, and the novelty of it is still there.


BUT, you DO NOT have to go to film school, to be successful. Robert Rodriguez never graduated the film program, and he made an award winning short (Look up "Bedhead" on Youtube) before he even got into it, and because he had horrible grades it was what convinced the guy who ran the film program to let him into the advanced courses.

He didn't even complete the program when he shot Mariachi over the Summer in Mexico.

Quentin Tarantino's famous quote of course, "I didn't go to film school, I went to FILM." He worked in a video store, and watched lots of movies. Never even went to College.

He just wrote, and watched movies, and he didn't let anyone tell him he couldn't, he got his script's to the right people, and pitched some ideas and they liked him.

What is important is two things, 1. Being able to show you can do things. 2. Being able to do those things cheaply.

Instead of bitching about not being able to get into a pitch meeting, shoot your film for 5,000 dollars, and make it look like it was shot for 100,000, and someone will give you a budget for your next feature.

Shoot some shorts, do well with them, and send them off to festivals, enter screen writing competitions.

If you keep doing both, and keep doing them WELL, you will get noticed, what is important, is at the time that someone with money says, "What else you got" you've got at least a handful of ideas to be able to pitch to them.

You've got to have good people skills, and be able to speak well, and looking good doesn't hurt.

Its unnecessary to go to film school, BUT film school can HELP. It's rare that people are exposed to shooting with film unless they get involved in a film program, with the program i'm in, all i've got to do is pay for the film, if I wasn't in film school i'd be paying daily rental fees that would approach the cost of my entire semester fees, DAILY.

So, if you go to film school, and you learn these production techniques, you'll have a step up on people that didn't.

Knowing how to do sound, knowing how to work camera's, having the discipline and technique that comes from having to work in film (knowing how to work in film, which is harder than working in video, your video work will benefit from the extra discipline that film programs into you.), knowing how to edit, knowing how to write, knowing lighting, etc. will make you more in demand.

Becoming the "one-man film crew" gives you a certain edge, because it allows you to work quicker and cheaper, and even when you aren't doing everything yourself, if you're constantly thinking about how to balance everything, it keeps you from doing stupid mistakes.

So really, it depends where you're coming from, and what you're doing.

Getting a BA is important, if you aren't sure you can cut it in Hollywood, make sure you are sure you want to do it before you try, going through the program will help you make sure it's what you want to do, and it'll help you make contacts that are going into the industry, and your professors will have contacts too, contacts are EASY.

If you go to Hollywood, and you get sick of starving, once you come back to the "real world", having the work experience, and your Degree will help you get a job being a pencil pusher, or you can work in academics teaching other film students.

[tonz0phun]

You know. Lucas, Spielberg and many others went to universities to study film. But others like, Kevin Smith did about 9 months of school, left, wrote and shot Clerks and got famous. It works for some, it doesnt for others, but it's always been about how dedicated the people are about what they love.

Just my 2 cents.

[edwardlavender]

right. it's really the matter of "do you have talent in what you want to do"

if you do...and you get famous without going to film school. that's awesome, but you kinda had it coming because you had the talent to get there.

but if you have talent that is hidden even by yourself. film school might uncover that talent.

no matter how you look at it, film school is fun, and would only be a drag if you let it be a drag.

I loved going, and don't regret it. but it's definitely not for everyone...at least the school I went to. a lot of kids dropped out because they couldn't handle it.

-zac

[KenOchalek]

I went to Full Sail...And another thing, I didn't get any "specialists certificate". I have an Associates Degree and Bachelors Degree.

-zac

Thanks for the correction. That was just the first name that popped into my head (that's what i get for shooting my mouth off, haha).

What I was thinking of when I typed that was a school in metro Detroit called Specs Howard which does give specialist certificates and has accelerated course for video and radio stuff.

In any case, the point is that choosing any college is a big decision. Almost every public university will have some sort of film/broadcasting program, and if you pick a decent program and are willing to take your film education into your own hands (i.e. don't expect your department to throw production opportunities at you), you'll be fine.

And as awesome as stories like Robert Rodriguez's and Quentin Tarantino's are, just be aware that the odds of you or anyone becoming a professional film director are so incredibly stacked against you. The only worse odds are probably for writers or actors.

But that's the beauty of things like Indy Mogul and this whole digital video revolution. All you NEED to make a great movie is a camera, some editing equipment, and a great idea!! (plus some patience, practice and a little money never hurts).

As long as your hearts in what you're doing, you can't go wrong. (Unless your heart is in contract killing....that's usually wrong.)

[edwardlavender]

yeah contract killing is definitely wrong...unless it's the contract for Rosie O'donnell...or Star Jones...or ya know...someone else that's really annoying.

but yeah, no worries on the certificate comment man, I was just clearing it up a little.

-zac

[edwardlavender]

In my personal uninformed opinion, film school is the biggest waste of money around.

You pay thousands of dollars just to make your own movie...under supervision. The supervision is the only benefit you get from film school that you wouldn't get from doing it on your own.

Also, they say you get cheap equipment rental and collaborators, but you can get both of those for free anyway. You don't have to be a student at the school to ask permission to use the editing room, and in all likelihood they will grant you permission.
For collaborators, all you have to do is post fliers at the local coffee shop or somewhere in your dorm. When I was in school, I met at least three amateur filmmakers and probably more that I didn't know were filmmakers.

Plus, at most schools, you have to wait one or two years before you can even get into the film program. So you have to take classes that don't matter to you, to anyone else, or to your chosen profession, for no good reason. Then there's a chance that you won't be admitted to the film program. Why? Because you have no talent for filmmaking? No, because you didn't get good grades in classes unrelated to your chosen profession. Then, even if you get into the film program, it may be one or two more years before you get to hold a camera.

On the other hand, if you're going to waste four years of your life, it's best to do it in your early twenties. Especially if mom and dad are paying the bills.

and thats just what your opinion is. uninformed.

end.

[bridboyross]

I went to the metropolitan film school at Ealing Studios to do a 3 week course not long ago and have been accepted back for next year. Personally I think that if you can then you should, you will make useful contacts, use industry equipment and have a window for distribution as many schools enter their students into festivals if they are good enough. Of course it is not essential as you may make an indie on your own but it will help to go.

[Jason Endurance]

Tell me about drop outs! 32 students started. By the end there were only 12 of us left. Only 7 graduated, including myself.

[WesScog]

At my program, most of the Film Classes are entry level, so you don't have to have taken anything to get into them, you can take them your first semester.

And it's a wonderful balance, so even though you've got to take extra classes for your Degree, if you sprinkle film classes throughout, you'll maintain a good GPA (if you're good at film), even if you don't do too well at everything else.

[edwardlavender]

Okay, Mr. Piracy. Why don't you steal some software?

While you're at it, why don't you pick a fight with someone online for no good reason?

I bought AVID, I don't need to buy anything else. I wasn't starting a fight with you. I was just stating that fact that you pointed out. Your opinion is uninformed. So really, keep your mouth closed about something you don't know anything about...unless it's to ask a question. You just straight up said film school was unnecessary and a big waste of money around.

I'm saying it wasn't either of those things. I learned Industry standard equipment and met some amazing contacts. AND my school helps me out with jobs all the time. Jobs I probably wouldn't have gotten had it not been for my school.

-zac

[edwardlavender]

no, he was lucky that someone noticed his talent, sir.

you can't go by basing your life by someone else's luck.

[edwardlavender]

hey, don't blame me, I don't subscribe to that "morally bankrupt philosophy. It's just too bad that that's how it works in Hollywood. You have to get noticed with your talent. And to be noticed by talent alone, in a sea of many MANY hopefuls, that's luck.

I like to believe that God picked him out of a bunch of people because he's rad and deserved it. Too bad other people in Hollywood don't believe that.

-zac

[WesScog]

Is Robert Rodriguez uninformed?

Uninformed? No.

Robert Rodriguez got into a film program, he went to film school to learn more, what he learned in film school helped him make El Mariachi.

He was talented and hard working, and loved movies.

What most people assume is that they are either talented or not talented.

Talent for storytelling isn't something you're born with, it's something you DEVELOP.

Shakespeare didn't get pushed out of his mother scribbling sonnets. He was lucky enough to be exposed to literature from and early age and became deeply fascinated with it, and spent the rest of his life mastering it.

Robert Rodriguez wasn't born a good storyteller, he was lucky enough to gain an appreciation of films from early on, and became obsessed with figuring out how to do it himself on his Father's ancient VHS video recorder.

He spent countless hundreds of hours working with it, and editing tapes on connected VCR's. This gave him an intimate understanding of film and visual storytelling.

It wasn't something he was born with, it was something he worked desperately hard to achieve.

He sold his body to science to get the money to make El Mariachi, he clawed his way through the film.

AND he was lucky that someone noticed his film, and was impressed that he was able to make it on NOTHING.

Film school isn't a waste of time or money, it all depends on the competency of your program.

It's important to have a degree, at least a BA, why not get it in something you love? Allows you to focus on it, and obsess over it under competent professors, and tough it out with other talented focused people.

We've already had 8 people drop out of the film classes, and we're not even half way done with the semester.

Its a TOUGH program, and it forces into you a sense of discipline that will be reflected in the expertise and efficiency of your work.

[WesScog]

Lucky that someone noticed his talent?

Meaning it is the judgment of others that determines one's worth, in your opinion.

That is a morally bankrupt philosophy.

Thats how it works if you want to make it as a professional.

Other's considering what you do talented, and being able to do that talented work efficiently is what separates the professionals from the amateurs.

If you do what you want only for yourself, thats fine, but don't intend for it to have mass market appeal.

Enjoying your work, and enjoying what you produce is important, BUT you've got to combine that with certain essentials that an audience would also find valuable, and that Film Producers would find marketable.

If you don't want to work in "The System", DON'T.

But some people want to make careers out of what they enjoy.

I would LOVE to helm a big budget project, give me half a million dollars, and that gives me money to make 50 films of my own, on my own time.

But other people finding worth in your work (JUDGING IT) is what separates successful material, from unsuccessful material.

People judge Indymogul.com, they judge Erik's work, and the IM team's work, BY VISITING IT.

If Erik didn't care about people judging his work, he wouldn't try to make it interesting, he'd either give a uninteresting walk-through, or no walkthrough at all.

Really, why should he care about who likes it or not?

But HE DOES care, the IndyMogul team puts a LOT of hard work into the Indy Mogul tutorials BECAUSE they care, they want them to be accessible, they want people to watch and enjoy them, they are THINKING about their audience.

Thinking about the audience, and making your work as good as possible because you know people are going to judge it isn't morally bankrupt, it's INTELLIGENT, it's a great deal of foresight because they want to be successful.

[edwardlavender]

Nobody ever said that he was waiting around for some big shot to give him a chance.

I said he was noticed by his talent. His talent in making movies. He makes fantastic pieces of cinema. And somebody noticed his talent when they saw Bedhead and when they saw El Mariachi.

He's an amazing filmmaker. But there are a million others that are trying to do the same thing that he did and they won't get noticed...even if they do decide to "take control of their own destiny". How come they won't get picked?


-zac

[KenOchalek]

Okay, Mr. Piracy. Why don't you steal some software?

While you're at it, why don't you pick a fight with someone online for no good reason?

I don't think anyone's trying to pick a fight. I think what we're discovering is that folks around here that have studied film/video at college have had very different experiences.

For example, at my school, you not only had to be a student to use the editing lab or check out equipment, you had to be working on a show for the college network or in a class that required it. This is because the department could not afford to repair or buy more equipment every semester, so they limited its use to people THEY had trained on it. And even then shit got broken ALL the time.

But you're right about having a hard time getting into classes. It can be a real problem at some schools. I taught a beginning studio production class for a couple years, and I always told my students that if they were serious about video, they should get their own camera and get to work. You cannot rely on your department to just give you opportunities. Good departments will have plenty of opportunities available, but don't ever think that your mere presence at film school entitles you to anything.

I think this is why a lot of people view college as a waste of time. It can be very expensive, and ultimately its what YOU make of it. And yeah, unless you're at a specialty school, you're gonna have to take general education classes. And that's because most colleges a)want your money, and b)want to help you become a well-rounded person (in that order, never forget).

But honestly, as much fun as an all film curriculum could be (and no offense to Zac or anyone else that went to a specialty school, this generalization is just to illustrate), would you rather be a filmmaker who has studied a little about literature, history, philosophy, psychology, science, etc? Or would you rather be a filmmaker who knows nothing he/she hasn't seen in another film?

Not to get to philosophical on anyone, but I believe every situation in life is an opportunity to learn something about yourself and the world you live in. Yeah, it may mean you have to struggle through something you don't like, but that's life sometimes.

And as examples like Tarantino and Rodriguez make clear, with the right motivation and determination, you can achieve the same ends through different means (i.e. not going to college).

So its a matter of whether the potential benefits of studying film/video at college (being around other filmmakers, equipment, and production opportunities) are worth the costs (tuition, dealing with academic beauracracy, having to take non-film classes, creative restrictions).

But I do want to say again, that earning a college degree (in film or not) is almost a no-brainer. That Bachelor's degree has become the price of admission for almost any decent adult job in America, and if you have the opportunity to go to college but choose NOT to, I feel like you'd be making a big mistake.

[WesScog]

I'm not knocking learning. You can see by my comments (http://forum.indymogul.com/showthread.php?t=168&page=2) elsewhere in this forum that I'm fanatical in my support of learning. What I don't necessarily support is paying someone else thousands of dollars for what you could learn on your own.


I don't know about the Schools in your area, but they DO NOT let you borrow their camera's for free.

The cost per semester, is a fraction of what it would cost me to rent a Camera for a 3 week shoot.

I get to become an expert with cinematography equipment, equipment that would cost me an order of a magnitude greater amount of money if I was renting them on my own.

The time it would take for me to become an expert in the equipment, would be equal to having the equipment for weeks, I wouldn't even be able to start my project.

Not to mention, SURE you can learn most of this, but what about the hard tales about making it in the industry, the ones that a lot of guys who want to just sell books don't go into a lot of detail about, and practical advice that a lot of books over look because its so elementary?

And you might have plenty of talented people in your area, just begging to work on some stupid kid's project, but I DO NOT.

The amount it would cost me to assemble a team of interested people would be in the thousands of dollars, professionals DO NOT WORK FOR PIZZA.

Student's in your classes do, and they can be really helpful. You network with them, you're connected to them, you co-operate with them.

And the professors, they're awesome, i've already been introduced to a lot of important films, and talked about them in depth, that otherwise would have taken me through a lot of personal research and "experts" of dubious ratings telling me, "Oh no, this is good, for this reason I just made up."

I'm REALLY happy with my program, really talented people, excellent school, knowledgeable professors, and a focus on practicality and working knowledge, rather than abstract expressionism, and video format editing. (Rather than the discipline that film format forces into you.)

Two things that have become rampant in many film programs, and leaves students woefully unprepared for real world careers in film making.


ARE THERE WORTHLESS FILM PROGRAMS? Yes, most definitely. It's just a matter of what YOUR FILM PROGRAM that you're looking at, how it is.

Most programs are useful, you don't' NEED to go to one to be successful, but even rogues like Rodriguez went to film school, and learned a lot from it.

He didn't GRADUATE from the program, but he went to it.

[WesScog]

The thing about quotation marks is that they're generally supposed to indicate what a person has said.

I haven't said anything about "The System," and I haven't said anything to warrant the response you just posted. You've created a strawman and shown your desire to beat on him for reasons of your own--as in, having nothing to do with me.



Thinking about the audience is different from thinking about power brokers who control people's destinies.

The audience ARE the power brokers.

What the Audience wants makes the power brokers CONSTANTLY change what they want to show them.

After Napoleon Dynamite became popular, they wanted to make cheap quirky comedies, and Heder became hugely in demand.

Things can get made well, cheaply, and it totally changes what the "power brokers" give funding too.

[edwardlavender]

Thinking about the audience is different from thinking about power brokers who control people's destinies.

To you and all of us, maybe. But to Studio Execs, it's the same. And those "Power Brokers" (see, I used quotes the way you like) are the audience when you're trying to get people to notice your talent.

-zac

[KenOchalek]

haha, I take more than a few minutes to draft a post and the conversation jumps miles ahead.

[edwardlavender]

haha, I take more than a few minutes to draft a post and the conversation jumps miles ahead.

haha I know right?? I thought I was making a groundbreaking post and Wes already had said pretty much what I was saying.
but another thing pink taco...or whatever your name is, you say you don't think you should pay for something you should learn on your own? That seems a bit strange...considering that's what you've been trying to tell me it's wrong.

-zac

[edwardlavender]

Imagine I'm the power broker.

If you show me something good, I'm going to like. Without question.

If you show me something engineered to be what I like, I'm going to think you're a subservient clown, and I'm not going to respect you.

That's the key distinction between producing things that are good and producing things the power brokers will like.

No one with talent produces bad work. That's a given. So focusing on what the power brokers want is a complete waste of time and misdirection of talent.

You really don't know how Hollywood works then sir.

Everyone likes to think that is how The Biz works. But sadly, it isn't. Execs want whatever sells and if Saw does well, then bring on the torture porn because everyone will eat that shit up with a spoon!

[edwardlavender]

If I didn't want anyone to know that I've been encouraging piracy of software, then I wouldn't have posted it on this forum.

What are you? Eleventeen?

[SyxxGage]

Film School, like anything else, is a different experience for everyone. I seen people go through it and absolutely love it. They gained hands on experience and had more opportunities with internship and other special projects that roll around. Others I've known have come out worse for the wear. Some have decided this is not for them and therefore wasted their money, while others go only to find out they could have gained the same knowledge on their own. I personally have not attended a school, but thats mainly to to financial reasons. I can suggest you pickup some how to books and see if the schools you are looking at can offer more for you then what you do on your own.

[edwardlavender]

You seem to think that flaming me somehow improves the quality of your arguments. It doesn't.

I'm not flaming you without warrant. You started this, and I'll be damned if I'm gonna let you, sitting up there on your high horse, finish it. I didn't ask for this argument. You did by flaming my posts about a piece of pirated software and then talking nonsensical garbage about film school and "power brokers"

-zac

[edwardlavender]

So you have a personal grudge against me, and you intend to
disrupt the forum by responding negatively to my future comments?

I don't like you, but I would never disrupt the forum if you are respond using logic and sense. I would never go out of my way to post negatively to you or about you. Unless it's the "I hate takopunch" thread that will no doubt be started in the future if you keep posting the way you're posting.

Just stop arguing with me about piracy being wrong and all the other BS you've been posting.

-zac

[WesScog]

Film School, like anything else, is a different experience for everyone. I seen people go through it and absolutely love it. They gained hands on experience and had more opportunities with internship and other special projects that roll around. Others I've known have come out worse for the wear. Some have decided this is not for them and therefore wasted their money, while others go only to find out they could have gained the same knowledge on their own. I personally have not attended a school, but thats mainly to to financial reasons. I can suggest you pickup some how to books and see if the schools you are looking at can offer more for you then what you do on your own.

Well everyone is unique, and everyone doesn't get to the same place with the same path.

It depends on the individual, and going to film school can make things easier for a lot of people.

I'm a more "rural" person, I have never lived in a big city, ever, and I am going to be moving to LA in a few years, so having professors that have been there and done that, it's important to learn from them about how to be prepared for it.

Being able to make connections with my fellow students, many of them which are also planning on making the Trek out there, it increases my chances, if one of them gets a break, i've got another connection into the business.

I am going to make it, it's just a matter of me working hard, i'm going to work as hard as I can, and i've got people I can give my scripts too that can give them to agents. I've got friends in the industry, and i'm not going to give up.

It's just, every bit of preparations makes my mission quicker and easier, being more experienced and having a better, more diverse portfolio of work makes me a better rounded artist once I get there.

[edwardlavender]

well said Wes, WELL SAID.

[edwardlavender]

I'd rather be unrighteous than self righteous. and I'm obviously NOT one who hates knowledge if I went to Film School to LEARN

This thread will be closed as well because of you arguing with me. Which is a shame because it was a helpful thread until you came along spouting off your nonsense.

To this, I ask Steve not to close this thread as it's helpful to other people seriously contemplating Film School.

-zac

EDIT: the post you just posted below this one has pretty much guaranteed this thread closed. way to go Charlie. I didn't start the argument sir, you did. Remember that. And please, if you haven't, read Steve's response to you right after he closed the software thread.

[WesScog]

It would be better if the argumentative posts were just taken out, instead of the thread being deleted or closed.

Or heck, keep them in there, shows it a controversial topic with very passionate sides.

[SyxxGage]

You all could just PM each other so the argument wont be in the public view.

[uhrisuh]

So guys ... what do you think about school .. should i keep going?

haha oh the drama

[WesScog]

Are you enjoying it so far? Are you learning?

[WesScog]

And are you going to Columbia, Collins, DePaul, Northwestern, AIC, or UC?

[uhrisuh]

Yes i love school... But im not going for film .. Right now Im getting my degree in photography. When Im done here (DEC 08) I'll be making my way to PA and being going to Tom Savinis Special effects make-up school .. damn I'm so freaking excited... I can't wait!

[WesScog]

Awesome! That sounds awesome! But he's just got a school, does he actually teach it?

[uhrisuh]

Yeah i think he does .. because when you visit the website you see him teaching classrooms with students.. As soon as i get the money i plan on making a campus visit.

[Maluro]

hehe well.. about this i only can say i wanna go to one in my city too
although its in school hours .. so i might during vacation
i'm not very sure either. but i think it would be a good experience :)

[SyxxGage]

You'll like Savini. He's a real nice guy in person.

[WesScog]

"I'll get you Chocolate man."

[edwardlavender]

Yeah i think he does .. because when you visit the website you see him teaching classrooms with students.. As soon as i get the money i plan on making a campus visit.

He's not an instructor there. He's only there like twice not counting the orientation.

A couple of guys at Full Sail went there. They said it was cool but they also said they hardly saw Tom. He does like two lectures. Regardless, it's probably the best SPFX school to go to.

-zac

[uhrisuh]

I still can't wait ..

[spicysmoke]

I'm going to film school just so my parents will get off my back about getting a tertiary education. And also to learn some of the technical aspects of film making. style and storytellying can not be tought, and thats what really matters.

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

I have just gotten into NYFA (New York Film Academy).
I will be in an intense 2 year Conservatory program in Film making.
The Classes will be from 9 or 10am - 7 to 10pm. 5 to 6 days a week.
I will get the opprotunity to use digital, 16mm, 35mm, and HD camras, and edit in Final Cut Pro, along with Proffesional Lights, Mics, Dollys, sets, and a crew and cast of actors.

I will recieve over 2,000 hours of intense hands-on film making, and get to use the beautiful city of NY as my playground =)

It will be extremely difficult and tiring, but well worth it.

I hope i can come back with things to share to all you fellow indymogulers =)

Has anyone else been to this school or is thinkign about attending this school?

[New Spark Films]

That is my dream school. I will try as hard as I can to go there. Really, good for you.

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

Thanks, it's not that hard to get in, Its just intense work and a lot of time.

[New Spark Films]

Thanks, it's not that hard to get in, Its just intense work and a lot of time.

I'm definitely willing to work hard and spend a lot of time.

[ericslovechild]

I really want to go there, but that place is soooo expensive.

[SyxxGage]

I looked into NYFA as well because it's so close to home, but I just cant afford it.

[WesScog]

Go by and say 'Hi' to everyone at the NNN offices.

[DarkMirageProductions]

What was the application process like?

[WesScog]

The NYFA had an opening for an student. After all the background checks, interviews, and testing were done, there were three finalists... two men and Beyondforeverfilms. For the final test, the NYFA faculty took one of the men to a large metal door and handed him a gun. "We must know that you will follow your instructions, no matter what the circumstances. Inside this room, you will find your girlfriend sitting in a chair. Kill Her!!!"

The man said, "You can't be serious. I could never shoot my girlfriend." The student said, "Then you're not the right man for this job. Take your girlfriend and go home."

The second man was given the same instructions. He took the gun and went into the room. All was quiet for about five minutes. Then the man came out with tears in his eyes. "That's really my
girlfriend in there! I can't kill her!" The Student said, you don't have what it takes. Take your girlfriend and go home."

Finally, it was BeyondForeverFilms turn. He was given the instruction to kill his girlfriend. He took the gun and went into the room. Shots were heard, one shot after another. They heard screaming, crashing, banging on the walls. After a few minutes, all was quiet. The door opened slowly and there stood the BeyondForeverFilms. He wiped the sweat from his brow. "This gun is loaded with blanks", he said. "I had to beat her to death with the chair."

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

Haha, im not sure what that lil story was about Wes, but i laughed hahah.

Darkmirage: Just filled out an application online like other colleges, with a 1-3 page "why do you want to go to NYFA and what do you hope to leave with" and a $35 fee.

[WesScog]

It was an old joke about the CIA looking for a new Agent.

[edwardlavender]

The Classes will be from 9 or 10am - 7 to 10pm. 5 to 6 days a week.


cough mickey mouse cough

full sail baby...thats the way to go.

-zac

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

im not sure what mickey mouse means haha.

Full Sail is a good college, but NYFA is also very good and its not in florida =)

[MrIndy]

What happens if you go there for 2 years but when you're finished you're still not talented?

[next-tarantino]

Haha, im not sure what that lil story was about Wes, but i laughed hahah.

Darkmirage: Just filled out an application online like other colleges, with a 1-3 page "why do you want to go to NYFA and what do you hope to leave with" and a $35 fee.

$35?! Well, that's how they get you.

Greedy bastards...

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

What happens if you go there for 2 years but when you're finished you're still not talented?

Then I Just Suck.



$35?! Well, that's how they get you.

Greedy bastards...

I know.... Damn them....

[BROKEN Productions]

Im going to VCU center for the arts and majoring there independent film program. but i was wondering, should i just go to collage or just film school or both?, and i dont wana waste time doing both when i could be making films after one of em. and does film school teach the same as a independint film program in collage?

[etentertainment]

Nobody cares. Go learn proper English. You can't complain because you already said something bad to me in the other thread. You know which one.

[glmclainmovies]

A collage is something you make with pictures, scissors and glue. A college Is a magical place where you learn stuff!

[BROKEN Productions]

Nobody cares. Go learn proper English. You can't complain because you already said something bad to me in the other thread. You know which one. well u were not making sence be more detaled next time and wat r u talkin about, new word are added to the dictionary every year so go buy a new copy and read up!

[New Spark Films]

Excuse etentertainment, he likes to cry.

[BROKEN Productions]

A collage is something you make with pictures, scissors and glue. A college Is a magical place where you learn stuff! ok who gives a shit about spelling u know what im talking about

[etentertainment]

College gives a shit about spelling. Look at yourself - how you bring up random subjects. You know what you read, and you know what I'm talking about.

[glmclainmovies]

ok who gives a shit about spelling u know what im talking about

College does young man,so remember your P's and Q's.

[etentertainment]

A collage is something you make with pictures, scissors and glue. A college Is a magical place where you learn stuff!

Thank you.

[etentertainment]

College does young man,so remember your P's and Q's.

Exactly what I said. Thank you, once again.

[New Spark Films]

College does young man,so remember your P's and Q's.

Haha, yeah.

[etentertainment]

If you're that lazy to use proper English when you're TYPING, I can't imagine how you write on paper using a writing instrument.

[glmclainmovies]

[quote=etentertainment;48118]Thank you.[/quote

No Problemo (although you shouldn't be talking ;))

[New Spark Films]

[quote=etentertainment;48118]Thank you.[/quote

No Problemo (although you shouldn't be talking ;))

I was just going to say that.

[etentertainment]

No Problemo (although you shouldn't be talking ;))[/quote]

I know but I felt like I had to say that.

[BROKEN Productions]

u both can STFU cuz im only in the 10th grade im not a fuckin 20 year old illiterate retard, and dont act like u have never made a typo in your life

[glmclainmovies]

u both can STFU cuz im only in the 10th grade im not a fuckin 20 year old illiterate retard, and dont act like u have never made a typo in your life

So what. Ignorance is no excuse. I'M 13 YEARS OLD! We're not trying to bully you we're just pointing out that you might want to work on your spelling and grammar if you want to be taken seriously in life.

[BROKEN Productions]

So what. Ignorance is no excuse. I'M 13 YEARS OLD! We're not trying to bully you we're just pointing out that you might want to work on your spelling and grammar if you want to be taken seriously in life. well the ET dude seems like it and so i miss taken college for collage that was the only time i have miss taken the two, i just wanted to post the thread cuz i needed advice quick

[etentertainment]

Ok.

[AlienWaveFilms]

just go to a colledge class

[zombiejoel]

u both can STFU cuz im only in the 10th grade


Your in 10th grade an this question you are asking is really THIS urgent? You got yourself 2 more years man. BTW you don't NEED to go to "kohl-ledge" to become a film-maker. But whatever you choose is fine. Personally I would go with Film School if I had the choice. Probably a lot more fun. Plus it lets you focus on just film making. Probably more expensive but oh well good luck in what ever you choose.

[BROKEN Productions]

Your in 10th grade an this question you are asking is really THIS urgent? You got yourself 2 more years man. BTW you don't NEED to go to "kohl-ledge" to become a film-maker. But whatever you choose is fine. Personally I would go with Film School if I had the choice. Probably a lot more fun. Plus it lets you focus on just film making. Probably more expensive but oh well good luck in what ever you choose.thanks ur the only one who helped

[robby453]

ET Ent. has some attitude, some unwanted attitude...

[etentertainment]

glmclainmovies and I both agree that we are not bullying you or anything. To me it's is just SO HARD and it physically hurts to see someone type that horrible.

Again:
If you're that lazy to use proper English when you're TYPING, I can't imagine how you write on paper using a writing instrument.

I'm sure many people could agree with that statement but probably nobody cares...I don't know why, nobody cares.

[BROKEN Productions]

glmclainmovies and I both agree that we are not bullying you or anything. To me it's is just SO HARD and it physically hurts to see someone type that horrible.

Again:
If you're that lazy to use proper English when you're TYPING, I can't imagine how you write on paper using a writing instrument.

I'm sure many people could agree with that statement but probably nobody cares...I don't know why, nobody cares.
JESUS FUCKING CHRIS I ALREADY TOLD YOU ITS A TYPO END OF CONVERSATION DROP THE SHIT!!!!

[zombiejoel]

This is getting out of hand.

[JoeTalls]

I'm not exactly sure why, but everyone here except for ZombieJoel has completely ignored the original question:

Which is the better route to go; college or film school?

I completely agree with Joel on this. Whether or not you decide to go to college over film school depends on what type of education you want to receive. If you go to a university and major in Independent Film, you're going to do a lot of hands on work with film - that's a given. But you will also get an extensive liberal arts education as well. Most colleges require you take a variety of classes (like mathematics, science, history, ect.) in order to make you a more 'well-rounded individual.' Also, if you don't end up working with film for a living, a Bachelor's degree from any four year college will do you a lot more good than a degree from film school.

However, if you're really serious about working in the film industry, film school might be the route to take. Film school not only gives you the education and hands-on experience you're looking for, but it also gives you the opportunity to meet more people in the industry. Film schools are more likely use better equipment and provide better resources for their students than most universities would.

Also, many filmmakers agree that you don't really need schooling at all. Their theory is this: The money you would spend on going to <film> school, could be put towards making your first film. And, to me, that makes sense. No matter how much you learn from whatever school you decide to go to, nothing will be more benefitial to you than just getting out there and filming your first movie.

As far as everyone who finds it necessary to argue over spelling and grammar, knock it off. I agree that people who use correct spelling, grammar, sentence structure, etc. are taken more seriously, but this is a forum. In fact, most of you who are giving Broken Productions a hard time have terrible grammar yourselves.

For example, I'll pick on the person who started the argument in the first place. I put their mistakes in red and my corrections in blue. They said:

---

"Glmclainmovies and I both agree that we are not bullying you or anything. To me, it's is just SO HARD and it physically hurts to see someone type that horrible (try horribly).

Again:
If you're that (too) lazy to use proper English when you're TYPING, I can't imagine how you write on paper using a writing instrument.

I'm sure many people could agree with that statement, but probably nobody (probably nobody?) cares...I don't know why, nobody cares."

---

For someone who was telling a 10th grader to brush up on their spelling and grammar, you might want to pick up a dictionary...or an English book. Additionally, you might just try to not be an asshole.

Finally, don't buy into all this arguing, Broken. You and I are both new members on these forums, but I know for a fact that there is no one more despised than someone who comes on here just to start fights. It completely goes against what IndyMogul is trying to do: help filmmakers.


Good luck!

[etentertainment]

JESUS FUCKING CHRIS I ALREADY TOLD YOU ITS A TYPO END OF CONVERSATION DROP THE SHIT!!!!

Alright but one more thing...

Why would I want to start a fight?


How is it a typo when you typed that same word three times
in the same paragraph? You typed wrong ALL THREE TIMES?
What a coincidence.



Collage or Film school?
Im going to VCU center for the arts and majoring there independent film program. but i was wondering, should i just go to collage or just film school or both?, and i dont wana waste time doing both when i could be making films after one of em. and does film school teach the same as a independint film program in collage?

[Scott]

thanks ur the only one who helped


Change your damn signature to something short. Something REAL mother fuckin' short.

[BROKEN Productions]

I'm not exactly sure why, but everyone here except for ZombieJoel has completely ignored the original question:

Which is the better route to go; college or film school?

I completely agree with Joel on this. Whether or not you decide to go to college over film school depends on what type of education you want to receive. If you go to a university and major in Independent Film, you're going to do a lot of hands on work with film - that's a given. But you will also get an extensive liberal arts education as well. Most colleges require you take a variety of classes (like mathematics, science, history, ect.) in order to make you a more 'well-rounded individual.' Also, if you don't end up working with film for a living, a Bachelor's degree from any four year college will do you a lot more good than a degree from film school.

However, if you're really serious about working in the film industry, film school might be the route to take. Film school not only gives you the education and hands-on experience you're looking for, but it also gives you the opportunity to meet more people in the industry. Film schools are more likely use better equipment and provide better resources for their students than most universities would.

Also, many filmmakers agree that you don't really need schooling at all. Their theory is this: The money you would spend on going to <film> school, could be put towards making your first film. And, to me, that makes sense. No matter how much you learn from whatever school you decide to go to, nothing will be more benefitial to you than just getting out there and filming your first movie.

As far as everyone who finds it necessary to argue over spelling and grammar, knock it off. I agree that people who use correct spelling, grammar, sentence structure, etc. are taken more seriously, but this is a forum. In fact, most of you who are giving Broken Productions a hard time have terrible grammar yourselves.

For example, I'll pick on the person who started the argument in the first place. I put their mistakes in red and my corrections in blue. They said:

---

"Glmclainmovies and I both agree that we are not bullying you or anything. To me, it's is just SO HARD and it physically hurts to see someone type that horrible (try horribly).

Again:
If you're that (too) lazy to use proper English when you're TYPING, I can't imagine how you write on paper using a writing instrument.

I'm sure many people could agree with that statement, but probably nobody (probably nobody?) cares...I don't know why, nobody cares."

---

For someone who was telling a 10th grader to brush up on their spelling and grammar, you might want to pick up a dictionary...or an English book. Additionally, you might just try to not be an asshole.

Finally, don't buy into all this arguing, Broken. You and I are both new members on these forums, but I know for a fact that there is no one more despised than someone who comes on here just to start fights. It completely goes against what IndyMogul is trying to do: help filmmakers.


Good luck!
THANK you so much! if you wouldn't have stepped in i don't think that this forum would have ever stopped

[BROKEN Productions]

Change your damn signature to something short. Something REAL mother fuckin' short. hahahhaha

[BROKEN Productions]

Alright but one more thing...

Why would I want to start a fight?


How is it a typo when you typed that same word three times
in the same paragraph? You typed wrong ALL THREE TIMES?
What a coincidence.
once again i wanted to post this quickly so i rushed through

[etentertainment]

Alright. I got it.

[DarkMirageProductions]

I think I have fully decided that I want to go to college for film making. I don't know the first thing about college application or any kind of college that has those courses available.

My high school also has no film classes to take, because it's too cheap for that. Yet they get a $1,000,000 grant and buy laptops and cheap knock-off SmartBoards that nobody uses. But that's a rant for another day...

I have learned what I know from watching a lot of movies and through websites (like Indy Mogul).

So here are my questions...


What are some good schools to study film making at?
What is the application process for a film school like? Do you have to make a video and show it or is it a standard interview?
Where would I look to find community film making clubs/meetings? What would I search for (i.e. on Google)?
Are there any good online courses or resources for film making that you think I should check out?
Thank you so much!!

[etentertainment]

Well first off, where are you based? If you're really willing to move far away,
there are great film schools in the Southern California area.

[ericslovechild]

Yet they get a $1,000,000 grant and buy laptops and cheap knock-off SmartBoards that nobody uses.

I know those! Mimeo boards, or mineo boards or somethiing... it's just the grey plastic thingy and one pen!

[etentertainment]

The visual and performing arts department at my school was supposed to get
new computers in September, and now it's the new year, and my teacher still says
"They're on their way" The computers we have there are old old old old Compaqs from 10 years ago which take 15 minutes to open Photoshop

[yourmindsinnerworkings]

i have the EXACT same issue school wise. we were ranked in the top 50 richest schools in the nation and we cant even support any cool stuff. all the money just goes to sports(minus the hockey team because the school thinks hockey is dangerous) and drama.

oh and school wise ive really had my eyes on NYU. im from the city and being able to go to school there and study film would be amazing personaly

[jburas]

1. Simple answer: NYU or USC.
Not-so-simple answer: It really depends on what you want. You need to consider cost, location, campus-life, etc. A lot of liberal arts colleges will have some kind of film major.
2. It depends on the school. Some schools don't require anything outside of the standard application, some require a sample of your work. Check out the applications of individual schools. They're usually online.
3. Call your city or state's film commission office. They usually have a good listing of these kinds of things. Also see if there's a nearby film festival.
4. This site! But what types of courses/resources are you interested in? There's many different aspects to filmmaking.

But no matter what school you go to, what you learn is really a matter of your own initiative. No school is going to make your films good. There are people who will pass every class and still can't make more than an edited home video. I've seen some really terrible films come out of USC and NYU. I've seen amazing films come from the most obscure colleges with only so-so film programs. It's hardly a matter of the school, it's a matter of the individual making the film.

[BeyondForeverFilmss]

Like people stated Above, its what You are looking for.

Some Good Ones:

UCLA-Film (have to have a 3.5GPA or above to get in.) and its pretty expensive, its in LA California.

NYFA NewYork Film Academy: A bit different, its not a university or college, its more of a degree program. Its VERY intense, you film 5-6 Days a week 8-12 hours or more a day. You learn everything about Film, and get to use the some of the best equipment for film. You can take 1year or 2year courses that are equivalent to 2-3 years in a college per year at NYFA. Its Located in SOHO, Manhattan Island NY, NY.
Easy to get in if you have money: $18,000 per Semester.

FullSail: Its the Cheapest of the 3, Not super expensive nor is it that hard to get into. Its located in Florida, and i think a few other places.

Those were 3 good Film Schools that are all different from eachother in their own ways. If you tell me where you want to locate, how much money you have, how good your grades are, if you want a degree, how intense you want to be trained, ect. i can give you some others.

[Brainstrained]

http://www.filmmaker.com/

check out the LOAFS section

[katz]

There are many schools out there if you look for them.

The School of Visual Arts (SVA) in NYC is the only school I have friends who major in film/video. What I've seen of their work (one more than the other) is really impressive too. However, being an art school, a very large art school, the tuition is expensive, really, really expensive. Plus the cost of living in the city will be something to consider.

[etentertainment]

My English teacher went to the New York Film Academy down here in LA. He made a
couple of films. He went only for a month or two...those small courses. He showed me
his films, they were pretty cool.

[dimaxx]

Vancover Film School

[WesScog]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_School#United_States

Here's all of the Film Schools in the United States. Take your pick.

[Kiltman]

Temple University has a really good film program. That is, if you don't mind being in center Philly.

I mean, Philadelphia is probably the coolest city ever, but that area...well, the death rate is about the same as Iraq...

[nooneimportant77]

vassar, just go all in, ONLY apply to vassar.

[ThreeOnAMeathook]

There's this new place in Downtown Chicago called Flashpoint. I guess its really nice and really good (really expensive, I think too...:()

I want to go there, but I hate driving downtown and am too broke. I hear it rules though.

[edwardlavender]

FullSail: Its the Cheapest of the 3, Not super expensive nor is it that hard to get into. Its located in Florida, and i think a few other places.


it's only located in Orlando Florida...Winter Park, Florida to be exact.

FULL SAIL ALUMNI REPRESENT!!!!!!!

[amc760]

Pick anyone.

I'm considering a film school (UCLA, or CSU Long Beach), but grades aren't so good. I have to raise my crappy gpa up a whole lot, you have to apply a year before the semester, and I'm already 21. And thats if I can even get in. A little disheartening.

To me, it seems the only things to get out of film school is access to equipment and the ability to network with other filmmakers..some who may move on to bigger things. Thats what the thousands and thousands are going into. Everything else you can learn your self.
But you can't network with other serious filmmakers by yourself..

[bwell]

I go to Miami and it's great. Lots of good opportunities, there is a film group that makes like 4 or 5 good films a year called QuantUM, then I write and crew for the late night talk/sketch comedy show called Off The Wire. I'm between semesters in my freshman year and have already gotten lots of good experience. And there are supposedly many internship opportunities. I was a Production Assistant for American Idol miami auditions, that was some good experience too although it didn't have much to do with film.

[_ray_biddle_]

First of all it depends on what you want to do. I went back to college after a twenty year SPRING BREAK. I did it for me. I choose to go to the Academy of Art University so I can do it online.

I can tell you honestly this may not be the best option, it is for me as I'm old now.

You have some choices, some you'll hear they are must attends and you've heard of them:
USC, NYU, UCLA and the University of Texas. If I didn't have a family and other obligation and was 18 I'd have went to one of these.

Now if you want a great education but don't need the name consider Vancouver or Full Sail, you'll finish faster but you'll get crap from those who think the first list is the only way to go.

Now if you don't want to spend the next 4 to 5 years somewhere and you want to get working go here:
Film School Online, you can get your certificate for a couple of hundred bucks and get the same education. You'll also save a buttload of money! And you can do it online!

I'm trying to remember the link:

http://www.filmschoolonline.com

I have taken just about all of their classes, I got a certificate in screenwriting. Don't let anyone tell you you have to go to film school, if you want to get book knowledge for yourself then do it!

I've been doing this for going on a decade now and the best way to larn how to make movies is to make movies. Watch as many films as you can, study them...pick them apart. That's what you'll do in film school anyway.

Learn everything about the process that you can, take a screenwriting class, take acting classes even if you don't want to be an actor.

When you make a film, do it like the pros. Use a great script, hire the best actors and use the best equipment you can afford. Don't waste money on the luxuries yet.

Read spec scripts as much as you can, don't read shooting scripts they've been altered.

Don't listen to those involved with Hollywood unless your only goal is to copy the same Hollywood crap. It took me seven years to get on a film set (due to location) the bigger your city the better BUT!! You do not need to be in LA or NY to make a living doing this. You'll need patience, you'll need to suck before you can get good.

Don't just focus on digital productions, find a Super 8 camera (I got mine on ebay for $1) and learn all aspects of making a film. Use this site!! i learned more in a couple of months about special effects and make up then I did the past two years.

Here's a $10,000 film school lesson, everyone at one time or another is full of sh*t in this business. Find people you can trust and work with them. As you get better take a minute and pass on what you know to a newcomer.

Best of luck to you!

[DarkMirageProductions]

Temple University has a really good film program. That is, if you don't mind being in center Philly.

I mean, Philadelphia is probably the coolest city ever, but that area...well, the death rate is about the same as Iraq...
I know. I live near Philly.

I didn't know it had a good film program...


Also thank you to everyone for your help!! I really had no idea to any of the answers to my questions (I'd heard of NYFA but never really looked into it cuz of cost).

[Darkmast508]

Sydney television, radio and film school, although it's much too far I think.

[baron von fogel]

Consider looking into film and video programs at art schools (these are pretty much schools from which you'll graduate with a Bachelor of Fine Arts degree instead of a Bachelor of Arts). The difference in these is like so:
At an art school, where you'll recieve a BFA, your curriculum will generally be 2/3 your art concentration (in this case Film) and 1/3 Liberal Arts (Art History, English, etc.)
At a college, where you'll get a BA, the curriculum will be more like 2/3 academic courses and 1/3 in-major courses.

I'm currently a Junior at the Rhode Island School of Design studying Film/Animation/Video and it's been really great. We've got all the equipment you'd expect from a top-notch film school, but it's a nice small tight-knit group (about 30 students in my department in my year) so you get to know and trust everyone. This is really important. Also, because of the numerous other departments at my school, I've been able to make friends with all sorts of interesting people like comic book illustrators, product designers, fashion designers, etc. all of whom I've been able to collaborate on film projects. I've used these people as storyboard artists, propmakers, costumers, etc. and that's something you won't be able to get from a regular university.

Anyway, that's my little pitch on behalf of art school.

[groovin'larry]

[deleted by user]

[DarkMirageProductions]

Consider looking into film and video programs at art schools (these are pretty much schools from which you'll graduate with a Bachelor of Fine Arts degree instead of a Bachelor of Arts). The difference in these is like so:
At an art school, where you'll recieve a BFA, your curriculum will generally be 2/3 your art concentration (in this case Film) and 1/3 Liberal Arts (Art History, English, etc.)
At a college, where you'll get a BA, the curriculum will be more like 2/3 academic courses and 1/3 in-major courses.

I'm currently a Junior at the Rhode Island School of Design studying Film/Animation/Video and it's been really great. We've got all the equipment you'd expect from a top-notch film school, but it's a nice small tight-knit group (about 30 students in my department in my year) so you get to know and trust everyone. This is really important. Also, because of the numerous other departments at my school, I've been able to make friends with all sorts of interesting people like comic book illustrators, product designers, fashion designers, etc. all of whom I've been able to collaborate on film projects. I've used these people as storyboard artists, propmakers, costumers, etc. and that's something you won't be able to get from a regular university.

Anyway, that's my little pitch on behalf of art school.
I was looking into something in New England because the scenery there is beautiful.

I didn't know the difference between those two before. Thank you!!

[amc760]

Yeah yeah yeah..I know common sentiment among indie filmmakers is that you don't need film school.
All film school's produce are elitist snobs who only think in terms of what the industry does, and paid tens of thousands of dollars for something they could've learned from reading the Rebel Without a Crew. Yeah..Ive heard it all.

But at the age of 21..I'm finding myself at a point where I NEED to transfer out of junior college.
I've never been very good in academics, so I need to go to school for something I'm willing to spend another few years in a damn classroom for.

So I'm pretty set on improving my grades to get accepted into a film school.
I'm not talking about CalArts, Brooks, or schools like full sail. I need to go to an actual accredited university that features a film program. Something I can get a degree in. Cuz we all know a degree in film doesn't guarantee a damn thing.
But worst come to worst..I wouldn't mind making a living teaching film theory or something like that..


So has anyone had any experiences they can share with me on these schools or film school in general?

Of course..I'd love to go to UCLA's film school, but I dont got a chance in hell for that.

I'm looking at
CSU Long Beach...they seem to have their shit together over their. Spielberg recently attended CSULB for a masters in film, and Luca made donations to the program. So I'm sure they got good contacts and faculty/facilities.

CAL STATE LA -They have a film school there that boasts a 3 camera studio..I think they do a lot of television too..Cal State LA has a terrible website..and I never hear much about that school in general..so its kinda questionable..but I don't think it'd be too hard to get into?

And if I have to..I'd probably be willing to go to the other side of the state to see whats going on at CSU SAN FRANCISCO or SAN JOSE STATE...although I'd like to be within a 3 hour drive to my hometown..which is why I'm primarily looking at LA area schools..


Any suggestions? Viewpoints?

[amc760]

CSU Long Beach...they seem to have their shit together over their. Spielberg recently attended CSULB for a masters in film, and Luca(*) made donations to the program. So I'm sure they got good contacts and faculty/facilities


* Oops..I meant Lucas....Luca didnt make any donations..he was too busy sleeping with the fishes.

[HunnyBunchFilms]

I'm currently attending a 2 year community college. I'm lucky my school has such an extensive film program. So far at my school I took classes in
Avid
Final Cut Pro
Television/Studio Production
Field Production
Video Production(our films get screened in a school based film festival)
I'm currently taking classes for photoshop, after effects, pro tools, and another video production class so I can have another short film in the film festival. I hate hearing people say they can't afford film school. You don't need film school, just look for a regular liberal arts college that has a film program. Honestly there is no way I could've learned all I know by just reading books.

[TheResignation00]

Im attended Kansas University next year. No, were not on the coast, but I think youd be REALLY surprised at how good the film program is. We have teachers that make movies that are screened at sundance.

[HunnyBunchFilms]

I hate it when people spew out how nobody needs film school. Sure you can go and make movies on your own but you'll get a great heads up and foothold on technology and techniques if you at least go to a liberal arts school with a film program.

[amc760]

Im attended Kansas University next year. No, were not on the coast, but I think youd be REALLY surprised at how good the film program is. We have teachers that make movies that are screened at sundance.
yeah for sure, i know there's plenty of great schools out of state. I'm not intentionally going to LA, its just that out of state tuitions are a nightmare! And LA is the closest city/area with schools that have film programs. It sucks because everyone and their mom who wants to get into film flock to California, and that makes these schools pretty competitive.

There's a lot of industry outside of LA and New York..lots of production companies looking for cheaper rent and more incentives in places like New Mexico, Arizona etc

[cronaldo]

you could go to the college that I grew up on the campus of. You can major in media and communications which is heavily based on film. However its in the icy grips of Manitoba, just south of winnipeg.

[amc760]

I hate it when people spew out how nobody needs film school. Sure you can go and make movies on your own but you'll get a great heads up and foothold on technology and techniques if you at least go to a liberal arts school with a film program.


Yeah, theres definitely lots to learn out there. Even Robert Rodriguez did some time at University of Austin, lol.

Not to say you can't make a great film, but it doesn't hurt to get the education..

The only thing is..a degree in it doesn't guarantee a career in film whatsoever. It's always gonna be your own ideas..and a whole lot of luck/contacts..at least in my opinion. And besides technical aspects..film school is invaluable for all the contacts you get. Being able to network with like minded people..some who may end up doing big shit.

But way I see it..if I don't find a career in film..I wouldn't mind teaching film theory..or something film related. And Im sure having a degree in it wouldn't hurt to try and teach it, lol.

[HunnyBunchFilms]

A degree doesn't guarantee you a career but when there's two dudes applying to the same position I guarantee the guy with the education gets selected.

[HunnyBunchFilms]

Lol sorry for sounding so "pro school" thats my mother's teachings talking.

[amc760]

No Im sure youre right.

Access to equipment, knowledge on how to use it, and contacts upon contacts will definitely give you a headstart to the big leagues.

[cubes]

My opinion is that it depends on the individual. I am an automotive and auto glass technician, run my own business, but have never attended formal training, because I was mechanically inclined it came easy. Same could apply to filmmaking, if you understand it and the concepts come easy, then maybe experience would be your best teacher. But if it is a new interest that you would like to pursue and have absolutely no background in, then some formal education might be best.

[jburas]

Get a degree; any degree. If you can put in the time and you can afford it, there's little reason not to. A degree won't get you anywhere in the film world. But a degree is nice to have if you never make it in film. The best way to get your foot in the door is to work for free on any job you can find and keep in touch with the crew.

[HunnyBunchFilms]

A lot of people don't think realistically, they think they are going to get paid right after college to make movies. I'm working on my degree and learning so many skills because realistically I would like to work for a production company as an editor or camera operator. I wouldn't mind doing that and funding my own short films and climb up the ladder.

[amc760]

A lot of people don't think realistically, they think they are going to get paid right after college to make movies. I'm working on my degree and learning so many skills because realistically I would like to work for a production company as an editor or camera operator. I wouldn't mind doing that and funding my own short films and climb up the ladder.


thats pretty much my plan as well...im hoping to have a degree to at least get my foot in the door, pick up as much as experience as i can, make a little money, then do my own stuff on the side.

and also have the option of a backup plan.

[BROKEN Productions]

well, im doing the independent film program downtown at VCU in a couple years, if that doesn't work ill probably move to LA and work on set and get to know and work with some people.
its very easy to find schools with a film program, even my HS has one

[amc760]

Vancouver?

[BROKEN Productions]

Vancouver?no, Virginia commons university

[delish23]

I would say that the necessity of film school depends entirely on your personality, and what you want to do with film. With technology and internet programming becoming steadily available and in demand- it really depends on what you want to end up making. I am personally, not a networker. I can't just stroll about meeting people. Film school is a way for me to do that at a slower pace. Other people have no problem with this. I have a couple of friends that have dropped out of school and are working on web serieses (is that pluralize that? ha)

Sure you don't, need a degree to work in the industry- but most professionlas, do have degrees. Other options include just taking classes. If you want to get into writing, take a screen writing class. You don't need to get into a whole film program to do that. However, if you want an intensive study on a specific kind of filmmaking, a CSU or University (with a program, obviously) will give that to you (in the short film format, usually).

I am a senior at Cal State Northridge in their film program. I have mixed feelings about it. They way the program is structured is that there is a portfolio application process to get into the program. You select an emphasis once you are accepted. I am in Sound. The others are editing and cinematography. But there are other skill classes everyone is required to take, a couple theory classes, producing, directing. So the program is really designed to give the students a well rounded palette. Whether or not the professors actually do this, is up for debate. Anyway, my dream since I was a freshmen in high school was USC film school. I come from a white middle class family and couldn't afford it or get financial aid. Graduate school at USC still isn't out of the picture- but internships are where you find your first jobs usually. I suggest getting into this as soon as you can. I will be interning at a production house in Santa Monica- mostly doing script coverage and other producing tasks (I'm sure errands are included. When it starts, I'll let you know) and it very well may lead other opportunities.

So I'm sure this probably hasn't been very helpful. But I guess I should just leave you with this; whatever you end up deciding, make the most of it. Cynicism won't get you very far. If you don't like the film program you get into, leave it, or try to improve the program. It isn't really what doors of opportunity the school offers- it's the people you go to school with, the friends you make. They'll be the ones you end up working with. So-it's attitude and perseverance.

Ok. I am rambling. It's late and I have class tomorrow. Good luck. And I apologize for any creative spelling or grammar.

[amc760]

I would say that the necessity of film school depends entirely on your personality, and what you want to do with film. With technology and internet programming becoming steadily available and in demand- it really depends on what you want to end up making. I am personally, not a networker. I can't just stroll about meeting people. Film school is a way for me to do that at a slower pace. Other people have no problem with this. I have a couple of friends that have dropped out of school and are working on web serieses (is that pluralize that? ha)

Sure you don't, need a degree to work in the industry- but most professionlas, do have degrees. Other options include just taking classes. If you want to get into writing, take a screen writing class. You don't need to get into a whole film program to do that. However, if you want an intensive study on a specific kind of filmmaking, a CSU or University (with a program, obviously) will give that to you (in the short film format, usually).

I am a senior at Cal State Northridge in their film program. I have mixed feelings about it. They way the program is structured is that there is a portfolio application process to get into the program. You select an emphasis once you are accepted. I am in Sound. The others are editing and cinematography. But there are other skill classes everyone is required to take, a couple theory classes, producing, directing. So the program is really designed to give the students a well rounded palette. Whether or not the professors actually do this, is up for debate. Anyway, my dream since I was a freshmen in high school was USC film school. I come from a white middle class family and couldn't afford it or get financial aid. Graduate school at USC still isn't out of the picture- but internships are where you find your first jobs usually. I suggest getting into this as soon as you can. I will be interning at a production house in Santa Monica- mostly doing script coverage and other producing tasks (I'm sure errands are included. When it starts, I'll let you know) and it very well may lead other opportunities.

So I'm sure this probably hasn't been very helpful. But I guess I should just leave you with this; whatever you end up deciding, make the most of it. Cynicism won't get you very far. If you don't like the film program you get into, leave it, or try to improve the program. It isn't really what doors of opportunity the school offers- it's the people you go to school with, the friends you make. They'll be the ones you end up working with. So-it's attitude and perseverance.

Ok. I am rambling. It's late and I have class tomorrow. Good luck. And I apologize for any creative spelling or grammar.

Thank you for the reply. I hadn't even considered Northridge..I need to look into CSUN.
I understood what you meant, and i do feel that one of the most important things to get from a film program is the ability to network with other beginning filmmakers..so I agreed with you there.

Question...after looking into admissions for CSU Long Beach and UCLA, I notice they only accept students once a year...in the spring or fall..
This kind of worries me because I'm already transferring kind of late (i'm 21), and I have a couple more semesters to finish/remake classes in order to be more competitive(higher gpa).

Is Northridge the same way? Do you have to apply a year in advance?
Also, how competitive is it to get into the program?
Are you generally happy with it?

Also what have you heard about the programs at CSULB and Cal State LA , if anything?


Sorry for all the questions, but you seem to be the only one going to school in the area, lol.

[Young&Bald]

My advice is unless your career NEEDS a degree- then you really ought to reconsider college- it isn't something to go into half-hearted for the money you pay.

If you want college, because of student loans, options, etc, locate a college that is a cheap state school, that offers Drama (actors), and at best a multimedia dept. (equipment) and maybe even a school tv station (editing) and even better some form of "movie" production courses- they come under many names.

Now find a town with a cable access station- for example- Enid, OK has a cable access station called Pegasys- $6,000 panasonic cameras and when they get to know you they let you use the brand new SONY cameras they bought last year. It has 2 production Studios, four Avids and a remote truck that you can have access to for $40 a year. Sure you have to air it on the station first and you can't "sell" it without paying them back, but I'm talking about practice and Experience.

See Enid is a small town, it has a 4 year college- I think- It also has cable access- cheap access to expensive equipment- SO by the time you finish a degree you can spend your free time and weekends cranking out shorts and/or features so you have a stack of stuff to show people, alongside a degree by the time you graduate. And since its an inexpensive education, you won't have the mega buck tuition to pay back.

And if you can find a college in an Independent Film making community- Portland, OR or Austin, TX you have a shot of learning more and having more opportunities ($ $ $) coming your way if you are where things are already happening.

Oh, Also- READ! Books are cheaper then tuition and sometimes more informative then the classroom. If you become passionate about self-study now, the rest of college will be a cinch.

And lastly- take a putz class once a semester. Pottery or Bowling or Billiards or walking- something very light and easy and fun- take stuff you wouldn't normally take, just to check it out.

[delish23]

They accept people every semester. So no worries there. As for ease of acceptance, it depends. It's gotten more competitive- which is why they have the portfolio submission now. I spent about a month putting mine together. Others did it in a couple of days and got in. The good thing is, they aren't looking for people that already know what they're doing out the gate- they're looking for people that can think visually, are creative and driven etc. If you do have a lot of expeirence, it definately won't hurt your chances though.

The pieces of the portfolio include a 12 (max) photo story- this can be a series under the same theme, or an actual story. A series of short answer questions about you and what you've done in the past, what you want to do, your opinion on the world, stuff like that. A 1 page essay/story. Some people write about previous filming experience- but I suggest writing a very visual short story. Show them that you can write interesting stories that can be translated cinematically. And the final part is like transcripts and stuff.

There are a few classes that are required before applying- screenwriting, photography, and some film history class. Check with a counselor to make sure that if you've taken some of these already, that they are transferable.

As for my personal opinion on the program- like I said, I have mixed feelings about it. I think that I got really lucky halfway through the program and found a great group of like-minded people with different abilties. So we work well together. But I've been in groups where I was the producer, director, editor, and team psychologist. Not fun. It really requires a lot of patience and maturity- At some point you will work with people who are incompetent and that can be frustrating. The structure of the classes can seem uninspired sometimes- but I think it can easily be supplemented by talking to the teachers and forming a relationship with them (nonphysical of course...we don't want anyone getting fired) and really using them as mentors. Most of them are incredibly kind and have worked professionally- so super knowlegable as well.

If you do end up at CSUN, I suggest getting to know Nate Thomas (department head)- He will decide your fate more than once. He chooses (with a panel, but has final say) people accepted into the program, and later which senior film proposals are chosen. I also suggest taking your production classes with Michael Hoggan over Nate Thomas; at least for CTVA 355 intermediate production. You will learn more, and he will help with and personal issues that may arise with group members if you need him to. And Hoggan is just awesome.


Hmmm....I can't think of anything else. If you have any other questions, don't hesistate. As you can see, I don't spare on the answers.

:hayguyz:

[amc760]

Thank you so much! I'm actually going to consider applying to northridge.

If its okay, I'll try contacting you later on if I have any questions.

Thanks again!

[dragonheart]

hey there!

I read your post and thought this could help although this is very far from what you're looking for. There's this filmschool in Asia that gives the best hands-on programs and has the hollywood mentors.They also have this state-of the art facilities. Well if you have time try to check this site http://www.filmschool.ph. For sure it would be a fun-learning experience! :)
(http://buzz.filmschool.ph/html/featuredworkshops.htm)

[MitchellStafiej]

Go to College in a Film program... would probably be more worth it.

Mitch

[thepie]

I went to NYFA for summer camp last year, and it was freaking insane. I have heard the college programs are crazy awesome, and i know i had a great time when i was there. It is a great way to connect with other filmmakers and get their tips, advice etc... I'm hoping to get into USC for film in a few years, but i doubt i will. Even so, have fun there, its a great place.

[Maluro]

That is my dream school. I will try as hard as I can to go there. Really, good for you.

I say the same as him.

[Herk522]

What happens if you go there for 2 years but when you're finished you're still not talented?
Then you're F***ed

[Jonathan Gum]

All the time since I found this site it was like "Ugh Film school sucks man" and all these people that are being interviewed (Not just the recent episode but many previous ones)

I love this site and I tell my fellow sophomores who are in the film strand of my school (Design & Architecture Senior High, DASH) about indy mogul.

It's like that chemistry law, when I support Indy Mogul, Indy Mogul (And everyone else) seems to hate film schools.


Why do you guys hate film schools so much?

[WesScog]

I don't. I'm attending Film School.

I don't think it's NECESSARY, but I love learning from experts, and getting to network and socialize with local filmmakers I would have most likely not met otherwise.

[nooneimportant77]

people just get to sound cool when they say "film school is just bs you don't need it anyway".

[Captain SteveBeard]

Well, the main reason it's up for so much criticism is because film school is mad expensive, and you may not even get any success from it. And then when you see all these internet celebrities who get tons of publicity and success because they can make funny skits, well, it would piss me off too if i put money into film school and not be in that spot.

[WesScog]

Film School isn't really that bad expensive, especially if you go into a smaller program like the one here at Mississippi.

Now at UCLA or NYU, yea, those are expensive ass programs. But you also get Spielberg showing up to give you lectures.

[Cadaver88]

I've never did well in high school. I don't think I would do well in film school.
I have a short attention span. But I would like to go if I had the chance.

[WesScog]

Well maybe it's just because you weren't as interested in the subject.

Film school is SO EASY for me, because I obsess over memorizing the camera parts, and I love learning Film making history, and techniques, it's all deeply fascinating to me.

[DarkMirageProductions]

I can't afford college, let alone a film school.

[Cadaver88]

Is it your first year at film school?

[_ray_biddle_]

You have to go for the right reasons. I am going to film school for myself. It also depends on if you have something you want from film school.

I mainly wanted to learn the correct terminology. All education is good and since only 1 out of 1000 filmmakers makes a theatrical released film it is good to be able to do something so you can put food on the table.

You'll hear a lot of people say "film school isn't necessary", this is true. Think about this, how many filmmakers are in LA or NYC right now doing something else as a job.

If they can make a living doing something related, then film school was worth it. If you decide to go to film school there's only a short list worth the investment.

There's only 1 that has a well respected online program. I go to Academy of Art University out of San Francisco. In my situation I could only go online. Their reputation is growing and they work with a lot of industry's bigger companies.

If you're thinking more traditional.

USC
NYU
UCLA

University of Texas


Vancouver Film School
Full Sail


The rest.

There's a cheap alternative:
http://www.filmschoolonline.com

This website offers a lot for very little money. I did their screen writing certificate program.

I also did their film making classes. As a factor to help me decide if I really wanted to go to film school.


This topic is one thing that pisses me off about Kevin Smith. He got lucky, he took a chance and it paid off. Most people won't be as fortunate.

Hey you young filmmakers that come here, you're an artist for a reason. BUT BE SMART ABOUT IT!

All education is good.




All the time since I found this site it was like "Ugh Film school sucks man" and all these people that are being interviewed (Not just the recent episode but many previous ones)

I love this site and I tell my fellow sophomores who are in the film strand of my school (Design & Architecture Senior High, DASH) about indy mogul.

It's like that chemistry law, when I support Indy Mogul, Indy Mogul (And everyone else) seems to hate film schools.


Why do you guys hate film schools so much?

[_ray_biddle_]

I can't afford college, let alone a film school.

Sure you can! There's some much financial aid available. My GPA in high school was a 1.55, I wasn't motivated a all. I still get grants and scholarships. I have loans too but you don't worry about them until you graduate.

[_ray_biddle_]

people just get to sound cool when they say "film school is just bs you don't need it anyway".


That is a plus:jared: and the ladies fall for it.

Now more then ever you're going to find to get a job in the industry you have to have a degree.


But you'll make this short film and everyone will love it and that will springboard your career. Sure this could happen.

But to be an assistant director now, you have to have a degree.

Unless you'll be happy just posting your stuff on YOUTUBE.


Everyone now wants to be in an independent filmmaker, this is dead! There's no such thing as an independent film anymore. Especially if you're looking at a theatrical release.

Independent filmmaker is just as disgusting as saying film school. Be a filmmaker.

[_ray_biddle_]

I don't. I'm attending Film School.

I don't think it's NECESSARY, but I love learning from experts, and getting to network and socialize with local filmmakers I would have most likely not met otherwise.


I hate my Abode class! But I love film school.

Hey Wes, I'm married (so this is dead for me)...does saying film school get you anywhere with the ladies?

[_ray_biddle_]

people just get to sound cool when they say "film school is just bs you don't need it anyway".

One more thing:
Below is more of to be in this business you need college.

Remember when Grunge music was new and fresh and people bought into the BS. That's what happened to the independent film movement.

Since 1985 name a film you think is an independent film, I'll crush those myths.

If any film you mention had a theatrical release that lasted more then a weekend, that wasn't an independent film.

Clerks-(One of my favorites,BTW) Lost its claim to being an independent film when Kevin Smith did (insert naughty wink) favors to the guy from Marimax.

Sundance is a myth, The last independent film there was Sex,Lies and Video tape. ow this festival is for the studio to pimp out indie flavored films.

Without any business classes how will you know what a good deal is for selling your film?

How will you find an agent? Agents (in case you didn't know) are on this Earth at Satan's request. Only deal with agent that work for a compnay that have three letter that they go by.

WMA, CAA and there's a few more.

The rest aren't worth your time or effort.

I know this first hand.

[WesScog]

Is it your first year at film school?

Technically second year. Although i've been studyng this stuff since the High School A/V program I was in, and i've been making short films forever.

[_ray_biddle_]

Film School isn't really that bad expensive, especially if you go into a smaller program like the one here at Mississippi.

Now at UCLA or NYU, yea, those are expensive ass programs. But you also get Spielberg showing up to give you lectures.


Hi Wes,

I'm paying $670 a credit. When you finish there (if you can) take a summer semester at UCLA. It will help big time!

Also, keep in mind both USC and UCLA offer cheaper summer sessions. I know quite a few people that went to the lesser know film school and added these programs.

Check with where I'm going for their summer program. I'm not positive on when but Francis Ford Coppola is teaching directing.

In terms of what your long term goals are, this may benefit you big time!

[WesScog]

That is a plus:jared: and the ladies fall for it.

Now more then ever you're going to find to get a job in the industry you have to have a degree.


But you'll make this short film and everyone will love it and that will springboard your career. Sure this could happen.

But to be an assistant director now, you have to have a degree.

Unless you'll be happy just posting your stuff on YOUTUBE.


Everyone now wants to be in an independent filmmaker, this is dead! There's no such thing as an independent film anymore. Especially if you're looking at a theatrical release.

Independent filmmaker is just as disgusting as saying film school. Be a filmmaker.

Well, from my experience, most people don't realize what Independent Film making IS. All it is, is making it without studio backing, it doesn't mean doing everything yourself, or not having a lot of money. Most people think it's not having any backing at all, while it's technically just an absence of STUDIO backing.

Terminator 3 was an Independent film, most people don't believe me when I say this, but it was, Private Companies and Arnold put up most of the money for the film, no studios payed for it, they only picked it up after it was created.

But "Independent Filmmaker" is a buzzword for a lot of people, they've never made a film before, and they just call themselves that, and it's kind of silly because it's such an all encompassing term that it fits so many different people.

[WesScog]

I hate my Abode class! But I love film school.

Hey Wes, I'm married (so this is dead for me)...does saying film school get you anywhere with the ladies?

I wouldn't know since i've had a steady GF since i've been in the program. But a lot of people seem to go two ways, they either think it's really cool and have a lot of questions, or they patronize you can make sarcastic remakes like, "Whoa! Mr. Spielberg here!", like I think i'm better than them just because i'm going to film school instead of something more "constructive".

[WesScog]

Hi Wes,

I'm paying $670 a credit. When you finish there (if you can) take a summer semester at UCLA. It will help big time!

Also, keep in mind both USC and UCLA offer cheaper summer sessions. I know quite a few people that went to the lesser know film school and added these programs.

Check with where I'm going for their summer program. I'm not positive on when but Francis Ford Coppola is teaching directing.

In terms of what your long term goals are, this may benefit you big time!

Well I am learning the basics, and working on a feature with a friend of mine on our spare time, we want to shop it around at some festivals and just start building a portfolio.

I'm already getting to meet a lot of really amazing filmmakers, network with people, and produce content regularly for the site, plus i've got the friends and family of mine already in the industry.

I'm planning by late '09 or early '10 to be done with my Feature, Graduated, and moving to either New York or LA.

If I get some kind of work or an internship somewhere before I graduate, I might take time off of school, and just try to progress my career.

It all depends on how much I am learning in the later classes, and what opportunities come my way.

[Fisherking]

'Hate' is far too strong a term to describe my feelings towards it. I don't believe that the rigours of formal education are of great assistance in learning an artistic disciple (with the possible exception of literature - but that's another discussion).

I was given the choice of pursuing film formally or starting a science degree. I chose the latter, reasoning that education in mathematics and science most befits a formal system.

[WesScog]

Well it's not just an artistic medium. There are technical aspects that are numbered and mathematic and structured. Film is a Convergent medium, neither artistic nor technical, but BOTH.

Understanding the inverse rule with lighting, and understanding the science behind color temperature, understanding how different lights work and why they throw off different color, understanding F-Stops, and specifics of film stock, the science of how they work, the engineering skill that went into making the camera, the golden ratio, rule of thirds, the specifics of lighting, and mood, and history.

There is SO MUCH history that goes into it, getting to see the first Muybridge film series with the first moving images captured on film, seeing the Lumiere brothers films the first films shown in Public, the first Animations, understand where it came from, understanding all of the various artistic theories and approaches, getting all of this from a Professor who has spent DECADES studying this, is FAR better than just digging it up on Wikipedia.

Not saying you couldn't learn this information on your own, but it's so enriching for me to talk to and learn from someone with so much experience.

Understanding where it's been, can help you understand where it's going.

Also, before you try to steer away from formalization and rigor, you have to KNOW the rules before you understand how to BREAK the rules. I believe this fervently, understanding the rules, the basics, lets you BREAK them later on.

[Fisherking]

Don't patronise me. I have several friends attending film school and I am aware that there are a multitude of technical considerations. I have a finite lifespan and understanding current scientifical thought and, hopefully, contributing to it is my ultimate desire. Thus, I will expend my greatest efforts in service of the aforementioned.

Anton Chekhov famously claimed that (paraphrasing) "medicine is my wife, literature is my mistress." I don't see myself pursuing film. I suspect I will find myself in the proximity of a camera recurrently, but I am not going to abandon the benefits of a formal scientific education in service of ensuring that I am around a camera in perpetuity.

[WesScog]

I'm not patronizing you. All i'm saying is that film is something that CAN be taught, and it can be deeply enriching.

And i'm not telling you to go to film school, or saying you can't be a filmmaker without going to film school, you might feel like you'd be more of a use to the world, and feel better about yourself being a mathematician.

Different strokes for different folks. I think it's great you're doing what you feel, but I am just saying it's not useless to learn film making.

[Dasleah]

Film school's great for the networking you get, and access to equipment that you wouldn't normally be able to afford. But for me, it boils down to this - 4 years at film school you'd end up making around 3 short films over the entire course. If you did it on the 'outside', you could make a short film every month, plus a feature or two each year.
Film school is great, but at the end of the day, you've just got to get out there and start filming.

[BoonMcNougat]

Film School + Making Shorts is what I plan to do.

I need to go to Film School, because having that certificate that says "Hey, I'm a filmmaker" gives me a heads up over all the other filmmakers when i go to get a job, like making commercials or whatever.

Learning by yourself is all fine and good, but I believe that you can only move forward by going to film school, not backward.

[Dasleah]

True, but you can certainly stagnate and end up no better than when you entered. I found that all the mindless technical and history aspects, whilst useful, can really sap the creative urges. After a while, it felt like all I was doing was memorising computer shortcuts and being told that 'we don't do creative here'.

[Jobless in Cleveland]

All the time since I found this site it was like "Ugh Film school sucks man" and all these people that are being interviewed (Not just the recent episode but many previous ones)

I love this site and I tell my fellow sophomores who are in the film strand of my school (Design & Architecture Senior High, DASH) about indy mogul.

It's like that chemistry law, when I support Indy Mogul, Indy Mogul (And everyone else) seems to hate film schools.

Why do you guys hate film schools so much?

I don't think every hates film school. Everyone, prior to me, made great points. My take is...

It's hip to say "I hate film school" but it goes deeper than just being hip. It goes to attitude and how people learn.

Attitude & motivation: Some people want it so badly, that they'll read every piece of crap about film making. Some people, in my opinion, is only willing to learn if they are in class. Who's more sincere?

How people learn: Not everyone learns the same way. Some people can conceptuallize reading material better than others. Some people need more physical reinforcement than others. Some people (ADD?) may need an external guide (Yoda?) to direct their attention to specific learning task.

External forces: Time vs money. Some of us may have the time or money or both for film school.

Film school PRO:
1, net working. Kevin Smith met his DP there
2, access to equipment 10,000 super16, HD, even 35mm if you're lucky. Your school may have a SteadiCam rig.
3, learn from your classmate's mistakes (wasting $$$$ on rolls of film in a bad experiement)
4, instructors 'hold your hand' thru learning, flying with a net
5, motivated classmates. Try convincing your friends and family to act in your shorts when they have a party to goto? Peer pressure can be good...it keeps you motivated.
6, experience with high end, costly equipment... see #2
7, you learn to cooperate in making your shorts...which is what 'real' film makers do in real life.

Film school CON:
1, it can be $$$$$$$$$$$$ costly. Locally, tv/film production is a fad or in vogue, one of the local college aswell as a community college started (about 5yrs ago) a program. The community college is the cheapest program in town.
2, waste of time. Why sit in class for 2 to 4 yrs when one can 'read the crap' out of every book one can get? This goes back to 'attitude': Who's more sincere? The person who actively tries to learn everything he/she can about film making or someone who mainly learn by sitting in a class?
3, Pacing (CONT of #2), for the time one spent in film school (2yrs? 4yrs?), one could had made a dozen shorts... assuming one was able to learn from books and not make too many mistakes. You're at the mercy of the class. If you're a fast learner, and read the entire text book in your first weekend, you may find it too slow when you're sitting in class with 25 other students.
4, You jockey for time on school's equipment...as oppose to, no film school = no equipment to jockey for.
5, Cost of film school can be the cost of buying a nice HD camera, tapes, mic.

For most people, there are more reasons for film school.


No film school: good chance of wasting money/time from making mistakes; but, the film maker can mitigate that by reading, watching DVD extras, networking (like indymogul forum), tenacity, imagination, etc, etc. YOu need more brains to make this path work for you.

With film school: One can learn a wider variety of techniques, mistakes, what-to-do, what-not-to-do...resulting in saving lots of time & money later on; but, you're on a slower pace (if you're a fast learner) and can get bored.

[_ray_biddle_]

Troma is probably the best example of independent film currently (like then or hate them). Once a film gets bought it loses (I know this is the goal) the independent status, in my opinion.

Terminator 3 started out that way but this is the exception. Arnold has enough money to start his own studio.


Well, from my experience, most people don't realize what Independent Film making IS. All it is, is making it without studio backing, it doesn't mean doing everything yourself, or not having a lot of money. Most people think it's not having any backing at all, while it's technically just an absence of STUDIO backing.

Terminator 3 was an Independent film, most people don't believe me when I say this, but it was, Private Companies and Arnold put up most of the money for the film, no studios payed for it, they only picked it up after it was created.

But "Independent Filmmaker" is a buzzword for a lot of people, they've never made a film before, and they just call themselves that, and it's kind of silly because it's such an all encompassing term that it fits so many different people.

[Fisherking]

True, but you can certainly stagnate and end up no better than when you entered. I found that all the mindless technical and history aspects, whilst useful, can really sap the creative urges.

I like this quote.

Has anyone ever read the literature of David Foster Wallace? He has an affected writing style - too self-consciously intellectual to convey anything of emotional profundity. It's as though, every moment, he wishes to remind the audience of the sheer volume of soul-destroying literary criticism he's inculcated during his academic career. He is far too consumed with his own neurosis about the perceived intellectual qualities of his writing that of his overall story-telling. More succinctly, as Charlie Chaplin said in the Great Dictator: "We think too much and feel too little [...] More than cleverness, we need kindness and gentleness." This is advice I feel is worth giving in a variety of circumstances.

[google550]

I can't afford college, let alone a film school.

Have you looked into some student loans? You can get a hell of a lot on a student loan, believe it or not. Money shouldn't be an obstacle.

[google550]

Different strokes for different folks. I think it's great you're doing what you feel, but I am just saying it's not useless to learn film making.

Good ol' Gary Coleman. Poor guy. I wonder what he's doing now.

[BinBinProductions]

i dont hate film school i want to go to a film school.

does any one know any film schools in washington?

[WesScog]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Washington_University

EWU is the only school in the state that is listed as having a Film Program. The main campus is in Cheney and a satellite campus in Spokane.

[BinBinProductions]

thanks wes i can always count on you.

[DarkPhantom]

Have you looked into some student loans? You can get a hell of a lot on a student loan, believe it or not. Money shouldn't be an obstacle.

It is an obstacle.
Of course you can have student loans that you pay off after college, but that's just the problem. You have to do a hell of a lot to pay back that loan and the interest keeps getting higher the longer it takes you to pay it back.

[WesScog]

It is an obstacle.
Of course you can have student loans that you pay off after college, but that's just the problem. You have to do a hell of a lot to pay back that loan and the interest keeps getting higher the longer it takes you to pay it back.

There are so many scholarship programs and grant money that you don't have to pay back that it shouldn't be an issue.

Not to mention there are a lot of cheaper programs around the country like the one here in Mississippi. We're half the price of some programs that only shoot on video, and we still shoot everything on film rather than video.

[Dasleah]

Of course, here in Australia, you only have to pay back your student loans if you earn over $39,000. So of course, the vast majority of Uni students make sure they never earn that much.
Not saying it's right, but its something I've got to take into consideration. I'm not sure how the system works in America.

[DarkPhantom]

There are so many scholarship programs and grant money that you don't have to pay back that it shouldn't be an issue.

Not to mention there are a lot of cheaper programs around the country like the one here in Mississippi. We're half the price of some programs that only shoot on video, and we still shoot everything on film rather than video.

do you mind if i ask some personal questions? as this might help me decide on a college for next year.

At your school how much is tuition? how much in scholarships, grants, and/or loans did it take off? Now with the remaining balance how are you thinking about paying it back after college?

because i've been warned that students are hit with the reality of paying back loans after college and it's more than they can handle.

[Jobless in Cleveland]

There is one more thing one can learn in film school that one can't learn from books and self taught (trials and errors).

That is all the antidotal stories of personal experience from instructors who worked in the field. For the money, this one aspect is as valuable as access to equipment.

Just today, I was talking to a few film makers and potential film makers. My take on 'film school' vs self learning is....

Using what I know about The Federal Air Administration-FAA's acreditation of flight training. The FAA certifies traditional class room style training aswell individual self training (videos, books, etc) prior to certification test.

An editorial addresses the advantage and disadvantage of each of the training methods.

Film school (FAA recognized class room training) guarantee everyone in the class room to atleast meat the minimum requirement to be competent movie makers (pilot). The individual self taught method (testing done at a FAA certified flight school) of film making can yield a superstar student (pilot. If that student has the motivation to excel in self training) aswell as lowly qualified pilots.

I read this (paraphrased) editorial in a private pilot training magazine a few years ago. After thinking about this thread, I had a flash of insight of some similarities between FAA's Private Pilot License training and movie making learning.

PPL cost about... 4,000-6,000 training (8wk course? half a year of college? full year?)
buying a new airplane... +120,000 (buy a camera, editing system, make a feature?)
used plane... 30,000-50,000 (buy a camera, editing system, a feature or many shorts?)


Film school: guarantee standard of all student (with possible superstars)
self learning: quality of education can be random and all over the map. Some superstar, some rejects, many inbetweens, no minimum standard.




Film school is very compelling specially if the instructor tells 'old war stories'.

[Citrus]

So what if I want to be involved in making movies but not sure I want to go to film school. What should I look for in a school? Does it depend on what exactly I want to do on a film? If that's so then I'll have to get back to you cus I'm still tryin to figure that out...

[Jonathan Gum]

Well why would want to make movies but not go into a film program?

[WesScog]

So what if I want to be involved in making movies but not sure I want to go to film school. What should I look for in a school? Does it depend on what exactly I want to do on a film? If that's so then I'll have to get back to you cus I'm still tryin to figure that out...

If you want to work on a film, but not be behind a camera, you'll want to focus on what precisely you want to do.

If you want to be a Gaffer, it might help to take some courses in electrical engineering, basic stuff, nothing super complicated, you'll just need to know how to do that.

If you want to be a steadicam operator, you can get special training for that, but not in college.

Most of the technical jobs have special schools you go to for it, there are training for pyrotechnicians, lighting, all of this stuff, but a lot of it isn't in Film School, Film school is primarily focus on camera operation, lighting, sound, editing, directing, that kind of stuff.

The more varied technical positions are not really focused on.

What you need to focus on all depends what you want to do.

[DeadFishProductions]

Film school sounds fun... I mean to actually make movies and gain qualifications is fucking awesome...

I mean like I always proritise filming over school at the moment anyhow but to be able to do it without getting hassled would be genius!

[lasalite]

which campus of UCLA are you talking about wes?

[New Spark Films]

I think that while you can't learn everything at film school, it gives you great experience and resources to get you started on serious filmmaking. It comes down to whether or not you can afford it, and how much you want the education.

[WesScog]

which campus of UCLA are you talking about wes?

UCLA School of Theater, Film, and Television in Los Angeles.

[ThreeOnAMeathook]

I think some people dislike film school because some film schoolers get a snooty attitude and have holier-than-thou opinions on pretty much everything, but I've found this to be largely untrue.

I have met people like that, but most film students are cool, regular people just like us. They aren't all elitist snobs.

I'd go to film school if I could. I've been looking into it, but it's retarded expensive to go to Chicago for it. I want to go to Flashpoint Academy, but it's like $20,000 per semester.

[WesScog]

DAAAAAAAMN. I pay like less than a 20th of that.

[Aspiring-screenwriter-pat]

I'm curious to see if the people from Indy Mogul will make any comment here.

[supamancody]

wes, just wondering what school in Mississippi do you go to? I'm from MS and was looking for one to go to.

[WesScog]

University of Southern Mississippi. Only film school in the state.

[_ray_biddle_]

You'd be better off going to Full Sail or Vancouver.

EWU is a great school but from what I have seen the film education is lacking. But the best side is the Spokane area has a huge film making community.

Currently (not including North By Northwest Productions) I know of four feature films being made in Spokane. I know of 3 more if you count surrounding areas all the way to Idaho.

If you count the student films coming out of EWU and the shorts that are in production, it has to be near 100 films.

Feel free to contact me if you have questions about EWU, I either know or have worked with or am currently working with a bunch of the students from there.

i dont hate film school i want to go to a film school.

does any one know any film schools in washington?

[director2007]

I'm attending the Minneapolis College of Art & Design (MCAD) in August for their 4 year film program. I am very excited because the school submerges you in all the various arts the first year and then lets you loose to pursue your intended major for the remaining 3 years.

[sanftner2003]

I'm in the process of looking up film making schools.

So far, the only famous one that I know of off the top of my head is the "New York Film Academy".

I'm looking for just film schools (to direct), and am not looking for a college where I could just have a major in film making. I kinda want a film school.

Do any of you know of any? and have u ever attended?

[elscottomagnifico]

I'm in the process of looking up film making schools.

So far, the only famous one that I know of off the top of my head is the "New York Film Academy".

I'm looking for just film schools (to direct), and am not looking for a college where I could just have a major in film making. I kinda want a film school.

Do any of you know of any? and have u ever attended?

USC and UCLA both have well known film schools as well. It isn't a matter of "just have a major in film". The film schools are more of separate entities that you have to apply to outside the regular portion of the colleges (You can't just get into the overall school and pick a film major over a science major - there is a full application process for the film schools). You can always transfer between parts of the college by applying later on, but it isn't as easy as switching majors.

You'd then go to the whichever film school, which just so happens to be on the overall campus.

[WesScog]

Arizona (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona)


Arizona State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona_State_University) - School of Theatre and Film
Scottsdale Community College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottsdale_Community_College) SCC Film School
University of Arizona (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Arizona) - Department of Media Arts
Zaki Gordon Institute (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaki_Gordon_Institute) - Independent Film Making(Yavapai College)
California (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California)


American Film Institute (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Film_Institute) - AFI Conservatory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AFI_Conservatory)
Academy of Art University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Art_University) - School of Motion Pictures and Television, San Francisco
Art Center College of Design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Center_College_of_Design)
Brooks Institute of Photography (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Institute_of_Photography)
California College of the Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_College_of_the_Arts) [7] (http://www.cca.edu/academics/graduate/film/)
CalArts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Institute_of_the_Arts) (California Institute of the Arts)
Cal State LA Studios (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cal_State_LA_Studios) (California State University, Los Angeles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_State_University%2C_Los_Angeles))
California State University, Monterey Bay (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_State_University%2C_Monterey_Bay) [8] (http://tat.csumb.edu/)
California State University, Northridge (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_State_University%2C_Northridge)
Chapman University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapman_University) - Lawrence and Kristina Dodge College of Film and Media Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_and_Kristina_Dodge_College_of_Film_and_Me dia_Arts)
Columbia College Hollywood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_College_Hollywood)
DeAnza College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeAnza_College) (community college)[9] (http://www.deanza.edu/filmtv)
Los Angeles Film School (http://www.lafilm.com/)- LAFS
Loyola Marymount University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loyola_Marymount_University) Department of Film and Television
New York Film Academy School of Film & Acting at Universal Studios (http://www.nyfa.com/)
New York Film Academy Summer Camp at Universal Studios (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) High School Program
New York Film Academy Tweens Day Camp at Universal Studios (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/programs/tweens/index.html) Tweens Program (Ages 10-13)
San Francisco Art Institute (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Art_Institute) [www.sfai.edu]
San Francisco State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_State_University) [10] (http://www.cinema.sfsu.edu/)
USC School of Cinematic Arts/USC School of Cinema - Television (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USC_Film_School) (University of Southern California (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Southern_California))
UCLA School of Theater, Film and Television (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UCLA_School_of_Theater_Film_and_Television) (University of California, Los Angeles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_California%2C_Los_Angeles))
University of California, Santa Cruz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_California%2C_Santa_Cruz) [11] (http://film.ucsc.edu/)
University of California, Irvine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_California%2C_Irvine) [12] (http://www.humanities.uci.edu/filmstudies/index/index.php)
Connecticut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connecticut)


Yale University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yale_University) - Film Studies Program
University of Hartford (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Hartford)
District of Columbia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/District_of_Columbia)


American University School of Communication (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_University_School_of_Communication) - Film and Media Arts Studies
Howard University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_University) - School of Communications
Florida (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida)


Florida State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_State_University) - School of Motion Picture, Television, and Recording Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_State_Film_School)
Ringling College of Art and Design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ringling_College_of_Art_and_Design)
University of Central Florida (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Central_Florida) [13] (http://www.cas.ucf.edu/film)
University of Miami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Miami)
New York Film Academy School of Film & Acting at Disney-MGM (http://www.nyfa.com/)
New York Film Academy Summer Camp at Disney-MGM (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) High School Program
Palm Beach Community College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palm_Beach_Community_College) [14] (http://www.pbcc.edu/MotionPictureandTelevisionProduction.xml)
Full Sail (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_Sail) [15] (http://www.fullsail.com/)
Miami International University of Art & Design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_International_University_of_Art_%26_Design)
Georgia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_%28U.S._state%29)


Augusta State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augusta_State_University) School of Communications - Television/Cinema
Savannah College of Art and Design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savannah_College_of_Art_and_Design)
Art Institute of Atlanta (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Institute_of_Atlanta)
Georgia State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_State_University) School of Communications
Illinois (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois)


Columbia College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_College_Chicago)
Collins College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collins_College)
DePaul University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DePaul_University)- Digital Cinema Program
Northwestern University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwestern_University)
School of the Art Institute of Chicago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_of_the_Art_Institute_of_Chicago)
University of Chicago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Chicago)- Cinema and Media Studies

[WesScog]

Indiana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana)
Ball State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ball_State_University) - Department of Telecommunications, Center for Media DesignIowa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iowa)
University of Iowa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Iowa) - Cinema and Comparative Literature DepartmentLouisiana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana)
University of New Orleans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_New_Orleans) - Department of Drama & CommunicationsMaryland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland)
Towson University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Towson_University) - Electronic Media and FilmMassachusetts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massachusetts)
Boston University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_University) (BU) - College of Communication (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_University_College_of_Communication) (COM)
Emerson College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emerson_College) - Department of Visual and Media Arts
Fitchburg State College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitchburg_State_College)- Department of Film/Video
Film studies at the five colleges (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Colleges_%28Massachusetts%29) [16] (http://www.fivecolleges.edu/sites/film/), which involves Amherst College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amherst_College), Hampshire College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hampshire_College), Mount Holyoke College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Holyoke_College), Smith College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_College), and University of Massachusetts Amherst (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Massachusetts_Amherst)
Harvard film studies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvard_University) [17] (http://www.fas.harvard.edu/%7Efilmstud)
MIT Media Lab (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_Media_Lab)
New York Film Academy School of Film & Acting at Harvard University (http://www.nyfa.com/)
New York Film Academy Summer Camp at Harvard University (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) High School ProgramMississippi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mississippi)
The University of Southern Mississippi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_University_of_Southern_Mississippi)Montana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montana)
Montana State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montana_State_University_-_Bozeman)New Jersey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Jersey)
Fairleigh Dickinson University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairleigh_Dickinson_University)
Princeton film studies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princeton_University) [18] (http://etc.princeton.edu/films)
New York Film Academy School of Film & Acting at Princeton University (http://www.nyfa.com/)
New York Film Academy Summer Camp at Princeton University (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) - High School ProgramNew Mexico (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Mexico)
College of Santa Fe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_of_Santa_Fe) - Moving Image Arts DepartmentNew York (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York)
University of Buffalo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Buffalo)
City College of New York (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_College_of_New_York), which is part of CUNY (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CUNY)
Columbia University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_University) - School of the Arts
Ithaca College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca_College) - Park School of Communications
New York Film Academy School of Film & Acting (http://www.nyfa.com/)
New York Film Academy Summer Camp at Dalton (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) High School Program
New York Film Academy Summer Camp in Tribeca (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/index.html) High School Program
New York Film Academy Tweens Day Camp (http://www.nyfa.com/summer_camp/programs/tweens/index.html) Tweens Program (Ages 10-13)
NYU Tisch School of the Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_University) (New York University)
Rochester Institute of Technology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochester_Institute_of_Technology)
School of Visual Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_of_Visual_Arts)
SUNY Purchase (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SUNY_Purchase)
Syracuse University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syracuse_University)
Vassar College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vassar_College)North Carolina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Carolina)
North Carolina School of the Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Carolina_School_of_the_Arts) [19] (http://www.ncarts.edu/filmmaking)Ohio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio)
Bowling Green State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowling_Green_State_University) - Department of Theatre and Film
The University of Toledo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_University_of_Toledo) - Department of Theatre and FilmOklahoma (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma)

University of Oklahoma (http://www.ou.edu/web/home.html) - Department of Theatre and Film
Pennsylvania (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania)
Drexel University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drexel_University) - Film & Video, Screenwriting & Playwriting
Temple University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_University) - Film and Media Arts
Point Park University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_Park_University) - Film and Video Production, Cinema & Digital Arts
University of Pittsburgh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Pittsburgh)Rhode Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhode_Island)
RISD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhode_Island_School_of_Design) (Rhode Island School of Design) - Department of Film, Animation and VideoSouth Carolina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Carolina)
Bob Jones University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Jones_University)Tennessee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee)
University of Memphis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Memphis) [20] (https://umdrive.memphis.edu/g-communication/www/filmvideo/index.html)
Watkins Film School (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watkins_Film_School) [21] (http://www.watkins.edu/degree/film/)Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas)
Southern Methodist University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Methodist_University)
University of North Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_North_Texas)
University of Texas at Austin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Texas_at_Austin) - Department of Radio, Television and FilmUtah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah)
BYU (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYU)
University of Utah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Utah)Vermont (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermont)
Bennington College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bennington_College)
Burlington College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burlington_College)
Green Mountain College (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Mountain_College)Washington (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington)
Eastern Washington University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Washington_University)Non-degree programs in the United States
Full Sail Real World Education (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_Sail_Real_World_Education)
CDIA - The Center for Digital Imaging Arts at Boston University (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=CDIA_-_The_Center_for_Digital_Imaging_Arts_at_Boston_Uni versity&action=edit&redlink=1) [22] (http://www.cdiabu.com/)
New York Film Academy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Film_Academy)
Los Angeles Film School (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_Film_School)
Independent Student Media (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Student_Media)
Pittsburgh Filmmakers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pittsburgh_Filmmakers)
Cinenosin Film Academy (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cinenosin_Film_Academy&action=edit&redlink=1) [23] (http://www.cinenosin.com/) - Internet Christian filmmaking

[17thletterfilms]

Buy the book Film School Confidential (http://www.amazon.com/Film-School-Confidential-Insiders-Schools/dp/0399533192/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1208902858&sr=8-1). It's an excellent, in-depth resource for film school information. Stuff you won't find online.

[WesScog]

All of the schools and programs that offer Film Degrees in the United States have been listed above, enjoy.

[WesScog]

Here, I stickied this, so anyone that has questions about Film Schools can easily find this article and look for schools in their state.

I'll add some international schools soon, for like Britain.

[sanftner2003]

I totally love how I live in Oklahoma, and Oklahoma doesnt have any. lol

[mopman]

is it hard to get into one of these? like could you hypothetically just make a masterpiece film and show them and get in right away?

[WesScog]

To get into the film program here at USM, I just had to pay tuition.

And make passing grades.

[elscottomagnifico]

is it hard to get into one of these? like could you hypothetically just make a masterpiece film and show them and get in right away?

Depends on the school. Some that are more well known and have more connections with "the business" are challenging to get into. You need good grades, a nice reel to submit to the school and the money to go there. Others, without the massive application rates, require decent grades and the money to go there. No matter how you go about it, just making a good film won't make any school go out of its way to let you in.

[ParangBoi]

I went to Dov Simen's 2 days film school.

Does that count??:rolleyes:

[sanftner2003]

I recently stumbled upon this site, and was wondering if anyone here has done it, or has comments about it.

http://www.filmschoolonline.com

I couldnt find a "contact us" link, so I cant ask them if its okay that I have dial up internet, and also if we are subposed to submit our work to them for a grade, of it its just merely a reference site to read and do your self.

[glmclainmovies]

I dunno. I would do a more thorough search though.

[NaziActionFigure]

That sounds like an really bad idea.

[jowo96]

I have my doubts to whether this qualification if attained would be very helpful contact your potential employer and ask them if this sort of qualification would be accepted, This will allow you to find out whether it is safe and whether it is worth your while.

If you want to do this just to learn more about film I would recommend probably just hanging around these forums experimenting with film and posting your short films until you develop a nack for it.

[WesScog]

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Movie_making_manual
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Film_History

[sanftner2003]

thanks

[sanftner2003]

tarantino, where u located?

I'm in McAlester, Oklahoma

[MitchellStafiej]

In Canada? Two highly recognized schools are the Vancouver Film School and the film program at Concordia University.

Mitch

[trspballer7]

my goal is to go to emerson in boston Massachusettes, but that may change seeing how I am only a sophmore.

[ArmedSaint]

i am going to full sail woot

[_ray_biddle_]

I totally love how I live in Oklahoma, and Oklahoma doesnt have any. lol

Look in California at Academy of Art University. They have an online campus. I go there, the school is great.

It is expensive though.

[sanftner2003]

im trying to get the money to go to New York Film Academy (campass in los angeles), or the Los Angeles film academy.

I even got a site up about me trying to go there. its www.PleaseSendMeToFilmSchool.com (http://www.PleaseSendMeToFilmSchool.com)

[yupfrank]

my dream is to go to the new york film academy
how much is it to go there
i was looking at the webpage but i dont get it

[sanftner2003]

i got a catalog from the new york film academy today, in the mail. you should go to their website and request it for free. its a whopping 112pages.

film making:
1yr filmmaking (2 semesters) - $17,000 per semester
2yr conservatory film making (4 semesters) - $17,000 per semester.

acting:
1yr acting for film (2 semesters) - $12,000 per semester.
2yr conservative acting for film (4 semesters) - $12,000 per semester.

producing:
1yr producing (2 semesters) - $12,500 per semester.
2yr conservatory producing (4 semesters) - $12,500 per semester.

Misc:
1yr journalism (2 semesters) - $17,000 per semester.
1yr screen writing (2 semesters) - $10,000 per semester.
2yr conservatory screen writing (4 semesters) - $10,000 per semester.
1yr 3D animation (2 semesters) - $17,000 per semester.
1yr Documentary (2 semesters) - $15,000 per semester.

[screamingdeathpunchpictures]

im trying to get the money to go to New York Film Academy (campass in los angeles), or the Los Angeles film academy.

I even got a site up about me trying to go there. its www.PleaseSendMeToFilmSchool.com (http://www.PleaseSendMeToFilmSchool.com)
Brilliant but kind of pathetic. Sorry but it just seems that way.

[sanftner2003]

i know. but atleast i cant say i didnt try. and besides, any money left over, will be given to another film school applicant next year. its kinda like a scholarship thing.

in 4 days, i've made $50. 2 donations from here in my state of oklahoma, and already a $20 donation all the way from california.

[yourmindsinnerworkings]

well id say wes took the cake

[nooneimportant77]

i have never heard anything good about that NYFA, the opinion from professionals in the industry i have heard is that its a camp for rich kids who like to make movies.

and keep in mind, it is not film school/college, it's an academy.

[sanftner2003]

who is wess?




ya. but you also earn 39credits per semester while doing the film making program, and those credits can be transferred to some accredidated colleges for to get your bachelors. (school cost is extra).

i kinda had the impression that its for rich kids, too. But I'm going to need to have a job while attending film school.

The only other one other than nyfa that I've heard about is the los Angeles Film School. But I'm not sure about that. It looks pretty small, and its only about 9 years old, I think.

If you could recommend about 3 other film schools in the country, what would they be? and I'll check into them.

[nooneimportant77]

i would highly recommend SVA (School of Visual Arts) also in NYC

i have taken classes there, and i learned soo much. i took some classes for film, and we shot on 16mm at least 6 times (it was a 9 week class meeting once a week). infact i liked the class enough that today i took a tour of the school. they have the highest end gear, they recently invested in new HD cameras, they just got HVX 200s all with 35mm lens adaptors. they have full final cut, avid, and pro tools suites, along with others i didn't get a chance to see. and what really amazed me is that almost all of the staff there IS in the industry, they're all working in pretty much what they teach. infact i know someone editing in the city, who is working right next to a teacher at SVA.

out of persional experience i can say that it is a VERY nice place, and the people there are truly professional.

i learned alot about that school, alot more then i typed out just then, if you want to know more you can PM me any time.

[WesScog]

who is wess?

I work for the site, I do blogs on the front page (one of my blogs is on the front page now.) and I moderate the forums (along with Arissa), I also handle 5 Minute Movie House.

[ericslovechild]

i am going to full sail woot
Wow, that sucks.

http://www.fullsailaccreditation.com/

[sanftner2003]

whats wrong with full sail?

about 5yrs ago, they would send me brochures. they did this for about 2 years. it was kinda annoying.

this is located in florida, right?

whats good/bad?

[sanftner2003]

I think im going about looking at schools the wrong way. there's soooo many that I get confused by all of them.

Basically, I just wanna go somehwere for up to 2years, do pretty much nothing there except film related, and then after that i want to go get a job in the film industry.

all these school sites talking about degrees, college credit, and all this other stuff confuses me.

[WesScog]

They don't have any real accreditation, i've heard good and bad things about them.

So I guess, go there, check them out yourself, and talk to some students.

For how much i'm spending on education, i'm going to spend, overall, less than 20,000 on all of my school expenses for the full four years i'm going to spend at school.

If I JUST took film classes, I would spend about 5,000-8,000, but I wouldn't have a degree.

It says that Full Sail can cost about 70,000, but I would check out with students that have been there.

[sanftner2003]

I just requested info from the new orleans university.

I'm kinda biased about where I would want to go to school at.

I'm 24yrs old and I live in oklahoma and my mother has lupis, epilepsi, and emphesema, so I live with her and take care of her.

I'm kinda hopeing to find a good school thats within 12hrs of here. But I'm willing to go anywhere int he country for a GREATLY accredited pilm school.

New orleans is 9.5hrs from here, so hopefully they have some good points about them. cause its only half a days drive from here.

i'm anout to request into from university of southern missippi.

but if I apply at an actual school, its gonna be hard for me. I think I scored about a 19 on the ACT, and was typically a C or D student in high school

[WesScog]

I highly suggest USM, it's where I attend, and we are expanding rapidly, with a new 7 million dollar 3 story facility, a full sound stage, and a recording/mixing studio.

[sanftner2003]

at USM, what is your major, and what is their film program like?

Im at their website right now, and its kidna hard to understand. I found info on stage performing, and etc. but nothing about film.

Also, I cant find a link that says "request brochure" or anything like that.

[WesScog]

http://www.usm.edu/gc/gcartsletters/film.php

My major is Film. The film program is kind of stripped down and we have a very DIY approach too it.

We still shoot in 16mm film, with Bolex's and Scoopic's. We do this because we think having to shoot in film, requires a certain discipline out of you that shooting with video only simply doesn't promote, and Camera Operators that were alum of the program have won many awards, our Professors consistently get asked by employers who hire our guys, "How do you teach your students? They always know exactly what to do."

Having to train with a lot of limitations, and having to get everything right on the first take creates superior operators, especially once you move into digital.

The program also teaches you how to edit on Final Cut Pro, and Avid (both very popular in the industry.)

The four main classes are Intro to Film Studies, Cinematography, Advanced Cinematography, and Editing.

In Intro you shoot a few very basic exercises, learn how to load film, how to work the Cameras, how to work the light meters, you learn about lighting, color temperature, camera parts, the basics of film, some basic history of when film was invented, etc.

In Cinematography, you take the final project (which you shoot out of order) and you cut it up and splice it together on the editing table. You also film an A/V essay where you have to sync up footage you shoot to an instrumental track. Then your final project is a 4-10 minute short film about basically any topic, can be experimental, animation, narrative, anything. But you learn how to use the lights, how to run the editing machines (you manually edit using guillotine splicers and tape on an editing machine.) You order and get your own film developed, etc.

Advanced, you shoot in color, learn about color shooting, lights, sound-sync camera operation, and you shoot a full sound/color short film about pretty much anything. You also get your footage telecined and you edit on the Macs we have set up, so you can also combine your footage with digital footage from any Camcorders you can get ahold of, but it still has to be shot primarily on film.

In Editing, you learn advanced editing techniques, and finish your final student projects you started in Advanced.

That is the core curriculum, there is also great classes in Animation (you indeed have to animate in it, along with learning Animation history), classes in Film Theory, Cinema History (Cinema from 1895-1945), Contemporary Cinema (Cinema from 1946 to Present), Westerns, Noir, Horror, (some other seasonal genre classes along with these.) There is also some Retrospective classes that focus on the careers and impact of specific directors (Like there is going to be a class focuses just on Hitchcock this Summer.) There is a class on Screenwriting, that requires you to complete an adaptation of a Short Story into Screenplay Format, requires you to correct an improperly formatted Screenplay, and requires you to complete a full 90 pager Screenplay, (You have a choice of either writing a slightly shorter Spec Script for a currently running 1 hour Television Drama, or a Original Film script, no one i've ever spoken to has ever written the Television Spec script, almost everyone opts for the more difficult full 90 paged original Script)

But the program overall is a comprehensive course, on Film and Industry History and Appreciation, Animation (History and creating your own), Technical Operation of Equipment, Editing, Sound Recording, Criticism, and an Exploration and Understanding of Film Theory.

But we are a small program, but we're actively working to expand, the University has earmarked several million for the program, and we've seen enrollment go up from a few dozen, to over a hundred.

And like I said, the facilities are being expanded, and we're going to have a full sound stage, a full recoding/mixing studio, and a three story building full of labs, editing rooms, classrooms, and a wonderfully stocked library of thousands and thousands of films and books on every facet of film-making, from history, to Biographies of directors, to everything.

As for our video/dvd/film library we've got everything from the majority of New releases to some very obscure experimental films, a lot of silent films, and a lot of stuff that me and some buddies of mine have submitted from our personal libraries that are almost impossible to find outside of our programs library.

http://www.usm.edu/gc/gcadmissions/index.html

Here is a page, it has PDF's with Degree Plans (that included a Degree plan for Film majors), and a PDF with course descriptions of everything offered on campus, including more complicated descriptions of what I mentioned above.

Also with all the necessary contact information for the University.

[sanftner2003]

I'm applying online. it asks me what campass do I wish to attend. hattiesbug or gulf coast?

I'm not sure what the difference is. which one is the main campass? I went ahead and marked hattiesburg. I hope that was right.

[WesScog]

Gulf Coast, the film Program has been moved down here.

[sanftner2003]

well, crap.

lol

[sanftner2003]

last year, I was at a friends house and I believe it was on the INDEPENDANT FILM CHANNEL and I came across a reality show about a film school.

If I'm not mistaken, it was the New York Film Academy (but I'm probably wrong).

Can anyone tell me about this (or any) film school show or dvd?

While im searchin for film schools to go to, I wanna search for dvd's on that subject.

or even if u know of any indy film (making) dvd's I'd like it if u could recommend any so I could look them up.

[Cadaver88]

Is this what you are talking about?
http://store.ifc.com/product/show/4688