Camera Guide

[KMProductions]

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Kalebt42/camera.jpg

I've seen so many "I have xxxx, what camera should I get?" that I thought it would be nice to have a in forum camera list. And I also listed some more of the cheaper cameras that Steve didn't in the camera review video. So if you have any questions or want another camera added, just ask or tell me about it.

NOTE: CCD stands for Charged Coupled Device. Basically its the chip(s) that are in cameras. You can have 1 or 3. 3 is better quality than a 1 because the camera has 3 chips to process the data coming in, instead of just one. Also when I say 1/6", that refers to the size of the chip. one sixth of an inch. 1/3 or 1/2 is better because it's bigger.

CMOS is another type of light capturing chip. It does the same thing as a CCD but in a different manner. Many HD cameras seem to be leaning toward CMOS chips.

Also when cameras say "HD" that does not mean they shoot HD like the big Hollywood HD cameras. It's all about resolution. 1920×1080 is true (full) HD. You can have formats like 720i, 720p, 1080i, 1080p. The i and p stand for interlaced and progressive. RED cameras have begun to use 3K, 4K, and 5K and even up to 28K.

NOTE #2: All prices are from B&H. The prices sometimes varied between retailers.

I mostly listed smaller, inexpensive cameras because
1) that is what most beginners will get
2) If you want a 1,000 to 4,000 dollar camera, you need to do your own research to make sure you get what you want.

NOTE #3: The links that are next to the store link that say "TEST FOOTAGE" are links to vimeo. They are clips of footage that were shot with that certain camera. Disclaimer: I have no idea what these videos are. Watch at your own risk.

I would really only suggest a Mini DV. They are the easiest. DVD is hard to import, and impossible with a Macintosh, and Hard Drive cameras aren't very compatible with any thing. So Mini DV is the best way to go. Also a mic input is a must. On-board mics are crap.

Mini DV

Click on the links to view the cameras.

Canon ZR960 - $249 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/597358-REG/Canon_2486B001_ZR_930_MiniDV_Camcorder.html#specif ications) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-ZR960-MiniDV-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B001OI2ZKA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1243103918&sr=8-1)
A pretty basic and standard camcorder. 1/6" CCD and a mic input. Also built in speakers but no headphone out.

Canon ZR950 - $209 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/539207-REG/Canon_2485B001_ZR_950_MiniDV_Camcorder.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-ZR950-1-07MP-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B00114LG8E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1207342961&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1044336)
Basically the same as the ZR800 but better quality, but you also pay more. Also no mic input.

Canon HV40 - $999.99 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/597424-REG/Canon_3686B001_VIXIA_HV40_High_Definition.html#spe cifications) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-VIXIA-HV40-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B001OI2Z4Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1243104536&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/4670524)
The next camera in one of Canon's most popular lines. 10x optical zoom, 1 1/2.7" CMOS chip, and a AA shoe. This camera also features a plethora of outputs including HDMI type A. It also shoots HDV and 24p. A little on the expensive side but it's definitely a trustworthy camera.

JVC GR-D870 - $199 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/537779-REG/JVC_GR_D870_GR_D870_MiniDV_Camcorder.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/JVC-GR-D870-MiniDV-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B00127WS5A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1207343310&sr=1-1)
This looks pretty decent. 1/6" CCD which is... eh ok but still good. It has a nice 35x Zoom and built in effects but NO MIC INPUT! So, this may not be good for an A camera but maybe good for a stunt camera or a behind the scenes camera or something like that. Also no hotshoe.

Panasonic PV-GS500 $699 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/415307-REG/Panasonic_PVGS500_PV_GS500_3_CCD_Mini_DV.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-PV-GS500-Camcorder-Optical-Stabilized/dp/B000DZFUIO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1207343382&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/889986)
3 1/4.7" CCD. Good quality, mic input, and a hotshoe that will even power certain accessories. It also has a built in LED light, and a SD card slot.

Sony's HDR-HC9 $899 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/537980-REG/Sony_HDR_HC9_HDR_HC9_HDV_Camcorder.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-HDR-HC9-Handycam-Camcorder-Starter/dp/B0014CYZU4/ref=pd_bbs_sr_4?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1223778035&sr=8-4) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1770572)
This is a really great camera. A 10x optical zoom, HD quality, manual focus, and a mic input. It also has a headphone output. Well respected forum member nooneimportant77 (http://forum.indymogul.com/member.php?u=11591) has a earlier form of this product and said that that camera was great and that he would recommend it to anyone. He said it had great manual controls like shutter speed, focus, zebra, and a lot more. He also said that, with the right setting, this camera can achieve a really shallow depth of field.

Canon GL-2 $1899 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/255811-REG/Canon_7920A001_GL2_Mini_DV_3CCD.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-MiniDV-Digital-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B00006FXHQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1207505670&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1386499)
This is a really nice camera. It's what Erik used in California and probably still uses every once and a while. It has 3 1/4" CCD, 20X zoom lens, tons of manual controls, 1/8" and RCA inputs, and a hot shoe. It also has a small shotgun-ish mic already attached to the handle. It has a top handle so you can hold it low easily.

Canon XH A1 $2,999 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/447098-REG/Canon_1191B001_XH_A1_3CCD_HDV_Camcorder.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-XH-A1-High-Definition-Camcorder/dp/B000H7GSG6/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1217466929&sr=8-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/2376013)
This is sort of like a really jacked up version of the GL2. It shoots in HDV and records to Mini DV tapes. It has many manual controls like Focus, 7 gain settings, built in filters, and shutter speeds. 2 XLR inputs, BNC, composite, and component. Overall a very nice camera.

Canon FS-10 $360 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/539223-REG/Canon_2686B001_FS_10_8GB_Flash_Memory.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-FS10-Camcorder-Internal-Advanced/dp/B00114LG7K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1220313988&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1721438)
Very similar to the ZR930 in terms of imager and features. The FS-10 uses an internal 8GB of flash memory and takes SD/SDHC cards. The FS-10 does have a mic jack. No hotshoe and 1/6" CCD.

[KMProductions]

Ok. My original post became too long. Apparently we have a text limit for posts. So here is the Hard Drive section.


Hard Drive (HDD) and Flash

Remember, HDD does not mean high definition. It stands for Hard Disk Drive.


Canon HG10 $499 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/516695-REG/Canon_2183B001AA_VIXIA_HG10_HD_AVCHD.html) Amazon TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1147086)
40GB, HD, 1/2.7" CMOS Sensor, hot and cold shoe, mic. input. This looks like just an all around good camera.

JVC GZ-MG360 $329 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/537785-REG/JVC_GZ_MG360B_GZ_MG360_60GB_Hybrid_HDD_Micro.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/JVC-Everio-GZ-MG360-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B001284B9A/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1211735355&sr=8-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/2382472)
Forum member ibend1 recently bought this camera and from how he described it, it sounds like he likes it. He said that the video quality was good and the built in audio was nice. This camera has a 60 GB harddrive and is not incredibly bulky. It can shoot in 4 different quality modes and has a video light. Also from what ibend1 said it has a touch screen. No mic input though, or hotshoe. It has a 1/6" CCD. If you want to see some footage that ibend1 shot go here. http://youtube.com/watch?v=dL-Y2wWNIyA

Canon VIXIA HF-10 $629 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/539290-REG/Canon_2573B001_VIXIA_HF_10_AVCHD_16GB.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-HF10-Definition-Camcorder-Stabilized/dp/B001144JQU/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1215641597&sr=8-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1885314)
For the higher price this looks like a good camera. a 1/3.2" CMOS sensor, plenty of manual controls, mic. input, video light. It only has 16 GB of internal memory which really isn't that much but you can always go dump it. Also it has a mini accessory shoe. It's not a regular hot shoe so you will probably have to get some sort of adapter.

Panasonic HDC-HS100K $799 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/575450-REG/Panasonic_HDC_HS100K_HDC_HS100K_60GB_HDD_SD_Hybrid .html#specifications) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-HDC-HS100-Definition-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B001BFLIWC/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1228672559&sr=8-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/1865441)
1/6" MOS Sensor, HD capabilities, 60GB Harddrive. It does have a mic input and a headphone jack and a coldshoe. Honestly, for the pretty good sized price I would go for something a little better. The 1/6 MOS sensor really is a downside. For 1000 bucks it just doesn't seem worth it.

Sony HDR-SR11 $949 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/553645-REG/Sony__HDR_SR11_60GB_Hybrid_HDD_Memory.html) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-HDR-SR11-Definition-Camcorder-Stabilized/dp/B00123XZNI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1229196040&sr=1-1) TEST FOOTAGE (http://www.vimeo.com/2372731)
1/3" CMOS, HD, 60GB HDD, Manual focus knob, touch screen, mic input, headphone. I'm pretty sure it has a flip back hotshoe. I'm sorta just neutral on this camera.

Canon VIXIA HF11 $829 B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/576006-REG/Canon_3079B001_VIXIA_HF11_AVCHD_Dual.html#specific ations) Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-VIXIA-Memory-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B001DTV95C/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1229195989&sr=8-1)
This camera seems good all around. It has a decent 3.2" CMOS censor, Mic input, camera mode, and headphone jack. It's HD and records to a flash card or built in 32GB of memory. It also has a touch screen and an HDMI output.

[ciwi286]

Awesome job! This was needed!

[KMProductions]

cool thanks. Any cameras you think should be added?

[mopman]

HV30, I know it is similar to the HV20 (the same camera pretty much) but it is the one most new camera buyers will get since they are so close in price at this point and it adds some features people have REALLY wanted. Plus it is the camera I am getting so I would like to see some opinions on it

[ciwi286]

Maybe one of the sanyo flip cams. I know its and sd Camera, but they come pretty cheap and If someone isnt sure they want to really get into film making, or is young with little to no money there pretty okay cameras.

aslo the Panasonic PV-GS320 only has a cold shoe.

[speekerphone]

Awesome job! This was needed! definatly was!

[BRanger62]

I recommend the HV30 as well.

But dont buy it from B&H, order it on Amazon, you will save like $200 bucks on its price at B&H.

[uhrisuh]

This is amazing.. Maybe for more product review you could search online? I dunno.

Mind if i change the title to something like: Camera Guide. And sticky it?

[toppie34]

Canon ZR950 has no mic input buy the zr 930 dont make the same mistake i did oh and i love this thread

[ace24]

The JVC Everio series are pretty good they record to hard disk, so it is just drag and drop with a USB cable.

Heres a amazon(this is the camera I use): http://www.amazon.com/JVC-Everio-Digital-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B000E15B18/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1207171593&sr=8-1

[Vaughn Whynot]

The JVC Everio series are pretty good they record to hard disk, so it is just drag and drop with a USB cable.

Heres a amazon(this is the camera I use): http://www.amazon.com/JVC-Everio-Digital-Camcorder-Optical/dp/B000E15B18/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1207171593&sr=8-1
but its a hdd....gross
lol

[mopman]

true 'dat. Although in some cases hard drives can be better. Mini DV is still the best for now I suppose. But just wait for the BLU-RAY CAMERAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[: ) sMILES Films ( :]

true 'dat. Although in some cases hard drives can be better. Mini DV is still the best for now I suppose. But just wait for the BLU-RAY CAMERAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


But won't the blue ray cameras record in the same HD format as HDV cameras? or were you just being goofy?

[ibend1]

what kind of camera does INDY MOGUL actually use? do they use hard drive, mini dv, dvd?

[ibend1]

also, what camera has the best picture quality (aside from HD cameras)

[mopman]

they use GL2's I believe. Best camera is mostly opinion and infact HD doesn't mean better it just means a higher resolution. A really professional SD camera like the GL2 still looks better than most low price consumer HD cameras

[ciwi286]

Erick said a GL2 but Justin says he shoots on a sony V1U

[toppie34]

I think the Sony HDR-SR10 4MP 40GB High Definition Hard Drive Handycam Camcorder with 15x Optical Image Stabilized Zoom is the best value for your money or the hv 20
os really good too

[KMProductions]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I'll look at those and add them. And I'll try to post some different links to different places.

[jburas]

I need to point out an inaccuracy:

CMOS is the HD version of a CCD.

CMOS and CCD have nothing to do with HD.

CMOS and CCDs are two technologies that accomplish the same thing in different ways. 3-CCD cameras have three sensors, one each for red, blue, and green light. CMOS cameras have one sensor that picks up all three colors.

[ibend1]

so, if my budget for a camera is around 400-450$, would it be best to get a mini DV?

[mopman]

But won't the blue ray cameras record in the same HD format as HDV cameras? or were you just being goofy?

well each blu ray disk has up to 50gb (double layer) of space so you could put some pretty insane quality video onto one.

[KMProductions]

so, if my budget for a camera is around 400-450$, would it be best to get a mini DV?

Yeah, Mini DV is the easiest and probably the least expensive (besides hard drive) But hard drive cameras tend to be hard to import.

[KMProductions]

I need to point out an inaccuracy:



CMOS and CCD have nothing to do with HD.

CMOS and CCDs are two technologies that accomplish the same thing in different ways. 3-CCD cameras have three sensors, one each for red, blue, and green light. CMOS cameras have one sensor that picks up all three colors.


um what? CMOS is what is used to capture the light in a HD camera. CCD is what is used the capture the light in a SD camera. So they are generally the same. I said that a CMOS is the HD version of a CCD. They do the same thing, but one is used for HD. You contradicted yourself there.

If a camera has 1 CCD then Red, blue, and green light comes through that chip. An HD camera has 1 CMOS. Therefore all red, blue, and green light comes through that chip.


NOTE: NOT ALL HD CAMERAS USE A CMOS CHIP.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~
On to the next question.

also, what camera has the best picture quality (aside from HD cameras)Really different formats wont very that much with quality. Maybe a little but not enough to really notice.

Just remember the number of chips and the sizes of the chips.

a 1/2 CCD camera is going to be better than a 1/3 to 1/6 CCD camera. So they bigger the chip the more light (and therefore color) it can capture. Then there is the number of chips.

3 = great!
1 = good

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

what kind of camera does INDY MOGUL actually use? do they use hard drive, mini dv, dvd?In California they used a Canon GL2 (which I will be adding to the list soon) but now that they are at the offices I think they use a Canon XH G1 or a XH A1. The GL2 is a 1/4 3 CCD mini DV and the XH are 1/4 Native 16:9 3 CCD.

[Egg Dude]

um what? CMOS is what is used to capture the light in a HD camera. CCD is what is used the capture the light in a SD camera. So they are generally the same. I said that a CMOS is the HD version of a CCD. They do the same thing, but one is used for HD. You contradicted yourself there.

If a camera has 1 CCD then Red, blue, and green light comes through that chip. An HD camera has 1 CMOS. Therefore all red, blue, and green light comes through that chip.


NOTE: NOT ALL HD CAMERAS USE A CMOS CHIP.



People seem confused. CMOS is NOT the HD version of a CCD. There are many CCD HD cameras and CMOS SD cameras. And there are 3CMOS cameras, like the sony hdr-fx7.

The diffence between them is that a CCD takes light and records an image to be sent to a prossesing chip, but CMOS combines a prosessor and recorder into one chip.

However, CCDs yeild a better picture but are more expensive to manufacture.

[KMProductions]

NOTE: NOT ALL HD CAMERAS USE A CMOS CHIP.

Im quoting myself.

I didn't know that CMOS could be used for SD cameras. Thanks for the info.

[: ) sMILES Films ( :]

People seem confused. CMOS is NOT the HD version of a CCD. There are many CCD HD cameras and CMOS SD cameras. And there are 3CMOS cameras, like the sony hdr-fx7.

Yeah, i was told that CMOS was just Sony's form of a CCD, though other brands might use it now, and i heard that a single CMOS would record better than a single CCD, but not as well as 3CCD. So i can only assume that a 3CMOS camera would be better than a 3CCD Camera. :steve:

[devin]

CCDs generally had better image quality and captured more light while CMOS was cheap to make, and had low power requirements. This changed around 7 years ago when canon first started putting CMOS sensors in their pro DSLRs. Since then the technology of both has pretty much crossed each other. Now, you can't really say that one is better then the other without looking at the exact camera.

Currently I am using both a Sony PMW-EX1 which uses 3x1/2" CMOS sensors as well as a Canon XH-A1 which has 3x1/3" (not 1/4") CCD sensors. I would look more toward the other aspects of the camera when comparing. In my case, the EX1 is better not because of using CMOS sensors, but because it records XDCAM EX instead of HDV, is true 1920x1080 not 1440x1080, and has 1/2" sensors instead of 1/3".

The big question is the type of footage you are looking to shoot. Many CMOS sensors are equipped with a "Rolling Shutter" which means they can have issues with bright flashing lights being cutoff mid frame. It can also cause a small amount of distortion when snap-panning the camera around. (search Youtube for "Rolling Shutter" to see examples) If you plan on shooting in a lot of live events like a concert, make sure you try the camera out before you buy it to make sure this won't affect you.

In the CCD side of the ring, they often are plagued by light streaks shooting down your screen when you get a very bright light source in your image. As an example, I am sure you have all seen videos where a light bulb come into the frame and all of a sudden a big light streak shot down the screen. Thats because of the way a CCD records images. The same thing can happen if you shoot with the sun somewhat in the frame. Most professional cameras almost completely counter this effect, but the consumer / prosumer cameras have been known to show it a bit.

Both technologies have benefits and weaknesses, it all depends on what you plan on shooting. Sorry for the long post.

[_ray_biddle_]

For those looking for the Sony HDR-HC7, this is an awesome camera. I get the same or better result then when I have used a Canon GL2. B&H will treat you great too!


For an alternative to the Panasonic PV-GS320, find the PV-GS300, this has a mic jack. It's an older model but works as well as the PV-GS500

[ParangBoi]

For those looking for the Sony HDR-HC7, this is an awesome camera. I get the same or better result then when I have used a Canon GL2. B&H will treat you great too!

Yeah, the HDR HC7 is really cool.


Now, can anyone recommend me a camera that does good slo-mo capture and night shots.

Thanks

[Egg Dude]

Yeah, the HDR HC7 is really cool.


Now, can anyone recommend me a camera that does good slo-mo capture and night shots.

Thanks

Actually, the HDR-HC7 can do true slow-mo like the camera indymogul uses.

[ParangBoi]

Actually, the HDR-HC7 can do true slow-mo like the camera indymogul uses.


Cool, thanks!

[KMProductions]

Woo more cameras added. HV30, GL2, another one that I can't remember. More on the way.

[ace24]

Hard Drive Cameras are the easiest in the world to import your footage to the computer, ever hooked up flash drive or an external hard drive, thats all it is. Though I must the quality isn't the best, but there are no tapes or anything but a USB cable.

[KMProductions]

Hard Drive Cameras are the easiest in the world to import your footage to the computer, ever hooked up flash drive or an external hard drive, thats all it is. Though I must the quality isn't the best, but there are no tapes or anything but a USB cable.
My friend brought a HDD camera over once and when we plugged it up all of the files were in some strange format, and you needed the software that came with the camera or another downloadable software. It was too much trouble.

[mopman]

yeah you forgot to mention the HV30 can shoot in 30p which is it's most important feature

[hardcore productions]

good job

[Shadeslayer34896]

What about Hi8 cameras. That's what I have.

[randychico]

What about Hi8 cameras. That's what I have. Is it a DIGITAL 8???? Because if its not, my condolences... if you want to edit footage on your computer then you'd be in trouble because first you wont be able to just upload what you taped, there of course are ways of doing that, but it involves either cables, an interface or a better camera, but then you wouldn't need the old camera to begin with :p But still, I have one of those and it's great to just do whatever with it, experiment, you could even try to edit it analogically with a VCR.

[Seraph0000]

yeah you forgot to mention the HV30 can shoot in 30p which is it's most important feature

that's actually it's only real improvement over the HV20

[KMProductions]

What about Hi8 cameras. That's what I have.\

Hmm I don't know much about Hi8 cameras. I'll take a look at them.

But remember, this is mainly for beginners and many aspiring filmmakers won't get a Hi8 camera because they aren't as easy to import and edit.

[lyhoproductions]

Thanks for making this dude.

[lawriejaffa]

Come on guys, we're missing some more expensive cams on the list that are still ultra common in indy filmmaking - wheres the DVX100, XL 1 & 2, HVX200, Canon A1, - the HDV and HD Dvc Pro cams - even if these aren't bought by members of the forum, there affordable for hire.

Regarding the CMOS and CCD, in general the advantages of CMOS have been in cramming in efficicency with regards to resolution and sensitivity (compared to CCD) but not with considerable drawbacks - for example it requires a 'Rolling Shutter' for which if you are not familiar with, I would check footage of to see whether that would effect your work.

I'd imagine the HV20 with 24p and 1080p is thee most popular, id keep saving up rather than buying a $200 consumer cam lol

[KMProductions]

Come on guys, we're missing some more expensive cams on the list that are still ultra common in indy filmmaking - wheres the DVX100, XL 1 & 2, HVX200, Canon A1, - the HDV and HD Dvc Pro cams - even if these aren't bought by members of the forum, there affordable for hire.

Regarding the CMOS and CCD, in general the advantages of CMOS have been in cramming in efficicency with regards to resolution and sensitivity (compared to CCD) but not with considerable drawbacks - for example it requires a 'Rolling Shutter' for which if you are not familiar with, I would check footage of to see whether that would effect your work.

I'd imagine the HV20 with 24p and 1080p is thee most popular, id keep saving up rather than buying a $200 consumer cam lol

Just name the cameras and I'll add them.:D

And Im definitely gonna add the XL2. But I may wait for a month until I get mine.:D

As for the video. It will probably come out this summer.

[ParangBoi]

Ok, how bout one for both good slo-mo shots and fast tracking shots?

I won't buy them, just rent em'.

[chainedflesh]

Just name the cameras and I'll add them.:D

And Im definitely gonna add the XL2. But I may wait for a month until I get mine.:D

As for the video. It will probably come out this summer.


I own one and can tell you it is an UBER camera. But you have to know how to work all the settings, otherwise you risk grain in low lights or color temperature problems in varied lights. But if you know what you are doing you can do just about anything with it.

Also I would wait for 2-3 months before buying one, because Canon is going to be dropping the price on it very soon.

[KMProductions]

I own one and can tell you it is an UBER camera. But you have to know how to work all the settings, otherwise you risk grain in low lights or color temperature problems in varied lights. But if you know what you are doing you can do just about anything with it.

Also I would wait for 2-3 months before buying one, because Canon is going to be dropping the price on it very soon.

Haha screw 2-3 months. I'm ordering it Thursday. Plus I have to have it in May. I'm shooting something for somebody I know.

[KMProductions]

Ok, how bout one for both good slo-mo shots and fast tracking shots?

I won't buy them, just rent em'.


What your talking about are hight speed cameras. They shoot like 1000 FPS. I wont adding those because they are really, specialty cameras. I will however mention if a camera that I review has adjustable frame rates.

[redtail5]

b and h has a $250 rebate with the dvx 100b (4 now) so i would recomend looking at that rather than the gl2

[ChristopherJ]

I currently own a Fujifilm S8000fd "hybrid" digital camera, and a Sony DCR-DVD106E Handycam DVD Camcorder, and I need some advice, but first a question:

I was wondering if shooting videos with the video mode of my Fujifilm Camera would result in some good quality shots, as when im filming with my Camcorder camera for some reason it doesnt come out good quality, but that may have to do with the fact that i have to convert the video files from the DVD, which i'm not sure if that does reduce quality or not. *(Sorry if i'm typing too much, it's a habit of mine)*


I was thinking about trying to sell my Sony Handycam to my parents and buying something a bit more suited for videos that will be edited on the computer. I find having to convert all of my videos before i can do anything with them a bit of a pain, depending on which of my computers i'm using (As waiting for the slower computer to convert files is a pain.)

Would a MiniDV cam be better suited to my needs than a DVD Cam? Or would it be a good idea to go for a HDD camera?


If this post doesn't really make sense, say so and i'll break it down, i'm quite bad at explaining myself sometimes.

[KMProductions]

I own a DVD camera right now and I hate the things insides with a passion. A Mini DV is much better if you want to edit. I would go with that. I'm not sure what your fujifilm camera is so I can't talk about that, but I think I have the same DVD camera as you. So in short I would go with getting a good quality miniDV.

[ChristopherJ]

Thanks a bunch :).

I've heard that the DV tapes shouldn't be used more than about... 2 - 3 times as it will impare the quality, is this true?

[Vaughn Whynot]

not really
i been using mine over and over

[MitchellStafiej]

I just noticed that this camera was released.

http://www.pci-canada.com/News%20-%20HVR-HD1000.htm

Any thoughts on it for an indy filmmaker and Film student?

Mitch

[elscottomagnifico]

Thanks a bunch :).

I've heard that the DV tapes shouldn't be used more than about... 2 - 3 times as it will impare the quality, is this true?

There isn't really a set number of times a tape can be used. The quality won't be impaired though. So long as the tape is in working order it will record the information (digital doesn't degrade, it's either recorded or not). The problem that comes about is a higher likelihood of dropouts as you continue to use it(parts where the tape isn't retaining the information - results in skipped frames).

[Harris Bros. Videos]

You need to add:
1)Panasonic PV-GS400
2)Panasonic PV-DV953
3)Canon Optura XI

These offer great video quality, many manual controls and features, and all needed ports.

After much research I've found that these are the top three cameras that I'm looking to buy with very limited funds.

I'll even write something up if you want me to.

[ChristopherJ]

Thanks for the advice guys. :)

Currently trying to look for the best MiniDV / HDD camera that I can afford, but most of the cameras i look at don't have a mic input connection. Also i find being in the UK makes it an extra challenge, as the cameras that have been recomended here don't seem to be available on any UK sites. I'll just have to keep looking.

[DuLt]

Personally I like using my mini DV tapes and storing them. To keep the raw footage.

Also I heard that Hi8=miniDV quality...? Right?

[elscottomagnifico]

Personally I like using my mini DV tapes and storing them. To keep the raw footage.

Also I heard that Hi8=miniDV quality...? Right?

Hi8 is the older analogue technology for video. It doesn't have the same quality as mini-dv, but the hybrid digital 8 does(made by Sony to use Hi8 tapes, but record digital). Digital 8 was more of an in between format from sony that would allow you to still view/digitize older hi8 info, but also record in the same format as mini-dv and interface with a computer via firewire.

[DuLt]

I got (borrowed) and Hi8 camera with DV output, can it be connected to a firewire?
Is it worth digital8? (I'm a retro enthusiast with photographic cameras, so I'm developing a taste for retro video cameras).

[KMProductions]

Well if it has a firewire output I'm assuming it probably does. The best thing to do would be to try it.

[KMProductions]

You need to add:
1)Panasonic PV-GS400
2)Panasonic PV-DV953
3)Canon Optura XI

These offer great video quality, many manual controls and features, and all needed ports.

After much research I've found that these are the top three cameras that I'm looking to buy with very limited funds.

I'll even write something up if you want me to.


Ooo cool. I will add these soon.

[elscottomagnifico]

I got (borrowed) and Hi8 camera with DV output, can it be connected to a firewire?
Is it worth digital8? (I'm a retro enthusiast with photographic cameras, so I'm developing a taste for retro video cameras).

If it's a sony with digital output (firewire port - often refered to as the DV or digital output on vid cams) it'll actually be digital 8 (uses the same tapes as hi8, but records video the same format as mini-dv). If it doesn't have a firewire port then it will be Hi8 which is different in that it is fully analogue video (Digital 8 reads the Hi8 info and digitizes it when plugged into a computer, but doesn't record analogue to tape). Are you sure it's Hi8?

On another note, Digital 8 is only really necessary if you want to digitize Hi8 footage, otherwise mini-dv is much more accessible and shoots the same type of footage. Hi8 can be fun to mess with though because it gives that retro video look (I shot a music video for a school project on Hi8 and it turned out pretty cool)

[chainedflesh]

I got (borrowed) and Hi8 camera with DV output, can it be connected to a firewire?
Is it worth digital8? (I'm a retro enthusiast with photographic cameras, so I'm developing a taste for retro video cameras).


Interested in retro stuff eh?

I have an old school Ikegami. It needs a lens, power pack and VTR... so basically it is the deck and head only.

Right now it serves its purpose as a rather large paperweight.

But tube cameras are good because they get a nice warm image.

[MitchellStafiej]

I just noticed that this camera was released.

http://www.pci-canada.com/News%20-%20HVR-HD1000.htm

Any thoughts on it for an indy filmmaker and Film student?

Mitch
Anyone?

Mitch

[mopman]

you know you don't have to say mitch after every post, it is displayed above your avatar

[MitchellStafiej]

you know you don't have to say mitch after every post, it is displayed above your avatar
I know but it's a force of habit...

Mitch

[jcl3628]

I looked at the JVC GR-D270 miniDV camera on amazon and i looks excellent for me and only $180.00 so i have $450 but im buying a $100 dollar guitar so thanks if you guys hae any other camera let me know

[OutOfTheBoxStudios]

I looked at the JVC GR-D270 miniDV camera on amazon and i looks excellent for me and only $180.00 so i have $450 but im buying a $100 dollar guitar so thanks if you guys hae any other camera let me know

Well, with the cash you save you could either save it up for something big eventually, or you can grab yourself a mic, like the atr-55 and still have quite a bit left over.

[KMProductions]

Ok I added some more.

Harris Bros. Video: I looked for those three cameras and neither B&H or Amazon had the first two. They may be obsolete? But I added the last one. Thanks

[Rainer666]

the jvc-HD3 ,HD6:)

[ibend1]

Ok, well, what about HDD or SD card videocameras... What are the best cameras (for afound 400-500 bucks) that are within those two categories?

[OutOfTheBoxStudios]

Hey KMP, you might want to add the Canon HG10, it's a hard drive camera, HD. Very good quality, easy transfer, etc. Here's a link to the specs: http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Canon-HG10-Camcorder-Review-33146.htm

It goes for about 700 bucks, has mic input, headphone jack, good white balancing, many modes, 24p, an amazing "movie mode", HDMI , direct AV out, etc.

[KMProductions]

YES YES YES!!!! I finally got my Xl2. Let me play around with it for a few days and I'll post the information on it. WOOO!

[ibend1]

Anyone? :)

[ibend1]

I may be getting a new camera within the next week or two, hard drive most likely so... what do you think of this model

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8668998&type=product&id=1196470791061

also... what is the difference between that model and this one?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8211534&type=product&id=1166235552112

[KMProductions]

I may be getting a new camera within the next week or two, hard drive most likely so... what do you think of this model

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8668998&type=product&id=1196470791061

also... what is the difference between that model and this one?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8211534&type=product&id=1166235552112

Sorry dude I didn't see your question.

I think that SD card camera suck. They probably don't have a high capacity which means lower quality. I would go for MiniDV but between those two I would choose HDD.

If you have Vista Home Basic you need the first one. The other says no Vista.

But the second one is the all around better one.

[ibend1]

ok, so, here at indymogul do they use HDD or mini DV? Some people say HDD is the best, and others reccomend mini dv

[ugman77]

for hard drive i would put the jvc gz-hd3 everio

its what i got and it works great, great quality and very easy to use

[KMProductions]

ok, so, here at indymogul do they use HDD or mini DV? Some people say HDD is the best, and others reccomend mini dv

IM uses MiniDV. That's what a GL2 is. They do have an HD camera though at NNN and I'm pretty sure it still uses Mini DV tapes.

And I would recommend MiniDV. It imports with any software and there are no weird formats.

[ibend1]

Ok... I went to the store today and i ended up getting a JVC everio 360.

[MitchellStafiej]

IM uses MiniDV. That's what a GL2 is. They do have an HD camera though at NNN and I'm pretty sure it still uses Mini DV tapes.

And I would recommend MiniDV. It imports with any software and there are no weird formats.
Yeah I'm thinking of downgrading to MiniDV from HDV. I've had nothing but problems from HDV.

Mitch

[KMProductions]

Ok... I went to the store today and i ended up getting a JVC everio 360.

woo cool!:D

[ibend1]

If you want i could give you a review of that camera to add to the main page

[elscottomagnifico]

Yeah I'm thinking of downgrading to MiniDV from HDV. I've had nothing but problems from HDV.

Mitch

HDV is an HD encoding format that still records to mini-dv. If it is an HDV cam, it should be able to also shoot normal SD mini-dv footage. Otherwise, you might mean HDD (hard drive) or solid state cam (They typically use avchd encoding) rather than HDV.

[mopman]

I love HDV footage the picture is so clear. I find it very easy to import.But I have heard it is kind of a hassle to edit on lower end systems. Oh and by the way I have a camera for you to add. The Canon XHA1, this is their cheapest Large type HDV camcorder. Pretty much the Camera every moguler aspires to own that shoots HD and is actually in a reasonable price range. Than again when scarlet comes out it's a whole new ball game

[elscottomagnifico]

I love HDV footage the picture is so clear. I find it very easy to import.But I have heard it is kind of a hassle to edit on lower end systems. Oh and by the way I have a camera for you to add. The Canon XHA1, this is their cheapest Large type HDV camcorder. Pretty much the Camera every moguler aspires to own that shoots HD and is actually in a reasonable price range. Than again when scarlet comes out it's a whole new ball game

For shooting good HD in a reasonable price range, the HV20/HV30 is a much better choice (if one need be on a budget). For having a pro looking rig that shoots good HD and gives you more control than you could care for, the XHA1 is the better choice. The issue with Scarlet is that if it takes too long to come out, other camera manufacturers may already be catching up in the price range (Still, for now, it seems amazing)

[KMProductions]

For shooting good HD in a reasonable price range, the HV20/HV30 is a much better choice (if one need be on a budget). For having a pro looking rig that shoots good HD and gives you more control than you could care for, the XHA1 is the better choice. The issue with Scarlet is that if it takes too long to come out, other camera manufacturers may already be catching up in the price range (Still, for now, it seems amazing)


A HV30 will never look as good as a XHA1. The chips in the XHA1 are much bigger. A small handheld may say "HD" but it will never be true "HD". In fact a handheld with a 1/6" chip that is "HD" is not as good quality as a 1/3" 3CCD camera.

[KMProductions]

If you want i could give you a review of that camera to add to the main page


Yeah sure shoot me a PM. That camera is at my local walmart so I'll take a look at it too. But go ahead and give me any good first hand info on it.:rolleyes:

[elscottomagnifico]

A HV30 will never look as good as a XHA1. The chips in the XHA1 are much bigger. A small handheld may say "HD" but it will never be true "HD". In fact a handheld with a 1/6" chip that is "HD" is not as good quality as a 1/3" 3CCD camera.

If you chose to read my entire post, you would notice that I stated that the HV30 gives good (almost comparable) HD for someone on a budget. Making the statement that a more expensive camera with bigger chips looks better is obvious (the HV30 has a 1/2.7" Cmos to the XHA1's 1/3" set of CCD's). I could also state that the XHA1 will never look as good as a camera 4 times its price (HV30 is 1/4 the price of an XHA1 - priced on amazon) - That would leave you in the realm of about $13200. With proper lighting and overall effort any camera can give a decent picture (some better than others).

The XHA1 is an amazing cam, but not everyone can afford it. That is why I stated the budget alternative for anyone looking around on the forums for options.

[tambrm1016]

OK, I have hit a brick wall in my movie making and have decided I need a better camera to finish my project. I want to stay in SD format due to editing issues, so I'm not interested in HD right now. I have $1500.00 in my budget which precludes a Cannon GL2 or Panasonic DVX100B. I have been comparing 2 cameras by Panasonic (The problems with the Cannon tape drives scares me) and have come down to these 2 choices.

Panasonic AG-DVC20 - $1250.00
Panasonic PV-GS500 - $700.00

There is little info on this site about the AG-DVC20 and I have only seen 1 thread comparing these 2 cameras. My obvious objective is to get the best video and audio quality for my 1.5K I need the help of the INDYMOGUL gurus to make a decision. Here is what my research has brought me to...

VIDEO
AG-DVC20=3xCCD 1/6" 460,000 pixels
PV-GS500=3xCCD 1/4.7" 1.07 MegaPixel

OK, what does this really mean? (Yes I have been using the SEARCH button!) What am I getting for the extra $550 in the AG-DVC20? And will I notice a difference?

AUDIO
Both cameras have 1/8" stereo inputs. So, is there a difference in the quality of sound I will get? Can I use a shotgun mike with 1/8" stereo output, or do I need to get an XLR converter and use more expensive mics?

MORE TO THINK ABOUT
Both cameras seem to have the same problem of having a lot of controls in the LCD menu instead of being controlled by buttons on the camera. Ray Bittle says the AG-DVC20 was a "Pain in the butt" and advised buying the PV-GS500 and spending the extra $$$ on mics. $550.00 is a LOT of money, so I want to be sure I don't regret spending it if I buy the AG-DVC20. On the other hand if it's worth it I don't want to regret NOT spending the extra cash if it makes a difference and my projects come out with a lower final quality than I could have gotten with the better camera.

I'm using Adobe Premiere Elements and FXHome EffectsLabPro on an HP Pavilion a1330n PC. 3800+AMD Athalon 64 Processor, 1.0GB memory, 250GB hard drive, a BFG tech graphics card (In case you need to know)

My goal is to make a feature length film (80min? A DVD) and do music video and short films. I plan to burn DVDs of my movie and distribute them for free. I also want to create a web site where people can download my movie for free in the highest quality format possible and burn their own DVDs for home viewing. (Does this effect my choice?) I made the mistake of NOT doing research before buying my Panasonic VDR-D210 with mini DVD and no mic input. (Sorry, I hadn't discovered INDYMOGUL yet. Now I know the error of my ways!) I would appreciate it if you folks would share your experiences and maybe do a little research in answering my question, especially if you have experience with either or both of these cameras (B&H has all the specs and info on these cameras) I still have a lot to learn about film making want to be sure of my decision before I make my biggest investment in equipment. I'm going to have to live with this decision for a long time...

Thanks!

BigRedMonster

[elscottomagnifico]

Actually, most HD camcorders will let you transfer the footage as SD and keep the tape as an archive of the HD. An HV30 would allow you to shoot in HD, but output it via firewire at SD resolution, leaving you with the ability to mess with the HD if you choose to do so later on. You'll also be set up for a transition to HD later, rather than needing to get new equipment other than a computer to process the data.

With most cams outside the prosumer range, you will have issues with controls being in the menu. It is typically a design shortcut to leave out buttons/switches/dials, but give some control through the pre-existing menu structure (It also leaves a desirable part - more manual control and dedicated buttons - to the more expensive cams rather than just larger chips, bodies and optics which newcomers to video aren't always obsessed with)

[ibend1]

I PMed you the review KMProductions

[tambrm1016]

OK, I have been looking at the Canon HV30 and I have some questions. How will the quality of video on the Canon HV30 with 1xCMOD chip compare when downloaded as SD compare to SD video shot on the Panasonics with 3xCCD chips?

If the AG-DVC20 has 3x 1/6" CCD chips at 460,000 pixels and the PV-GS500 has 3x 1/4.7 CCD chips at 1.07 megapixels, isn't the PV-GS500 going to have better quality video? Since the audio capabilities are the same the AG-DVC20 seems like a waste of money.

I would love some input from folks who have worked with these cameras.

Thanks!

[elscottomagnifico]

OK, I have been looking at the Canon HV30 and I have some questions. How will the quality of video on the Canon HV30 with 1xCMOD chip compare when downloaded as SD compare to SD video shot on the Panasonics with 3xCCD chips?

If the AG-DVC20 has 3x 1/6" CCD chips at 460,000 pixels and the PV-GS500 has 3x 1/4.7 CCD chips at 1.07 megapixels, isn't the PV-GS500 going to have better quality video? Since the audio capabilities are the same the AG-DVC20 seems like a waste of money.

I would love some input from folks who have worked with these cameras.

Thanks!

The HD CMOS footage converted to SD will be at least as good as the footage from the GS500. You will also have leeway for editing footage (If your output will be SD, you can crop the HD picture to an SD sized portion - essentially digital zoom - that will then downsize to SD without much issue).

The chip size between the DVC and GS doesn't necessarily mean one has better quality video. There are many factors that will affect video quality other than chip size alone (especially in the less than 1/3" chip market). In this bracket, chip size will indicate more toward better lowlight (pixel count will affect this too - more pixels in the same space means each pixel gets less light).

[tambrm1016]

Hmmm... I'm still not convinced I should spend the extra money on HD. I wish somebody out there REALLY could tell me what kind of difference each camera would make. Watching video shot on them on YouTube is useless for obvious reasons...

[_ray_biddle_]

OK, I have hit a brick wall in my movie making and have decided I need a better camera to finish my project. I want to stay in SD format due to editing issues, so I'm not interested in HD right now. I have $1500.00 in my budget which precludes a Cannon GL2 or Panasonic DVX100B. I have been comparing 2 cameras by Panasonic (The problems with the Cannon tape drives scares me) and have come down to these 2 choices.

Panasonic AG-DVC20 - $1250.00
Panasonic PV-GS500 - $700.00

There is little info on this site about the AG-DVC20 and I have only seen 1 thread comparing these 2 cameras. My obvious objective is to get the best video and audio quality for my 1.5K I need the help of the INDYMOGUL gurus to make a decision. Here is what my research has brought me to...

VIDEO
AG-DVC20=3xCCD 1/6" 460,000 pixels
PV-GS500=3xCCD 1/4.7" 1.07 MegaPixel

OK, what does this really mean? (Yes I have been using the SEARCH button!) What am I getting for the extra $550 in the AG-DVC20? And will I notice a difference?

AUDIO
Both cameras have 1/8" stereo inputs. So, is there a difference in the quality of sound I will get? Can I use a shotgun mike with 1/8" stereo output, or do I need to get an XLR converter and use more expensive mics?

MORE TO THINK ABOUT
Both cameras seem to have the same problem of having a lot of controls in the LCD menu instead of being controlled by buttons on the camera. Ray Bittle says the AG-DVC20 was a "Pain in the butt" and advised buying the PV-GS500 and spending the extra $$$ on mics. $550.00 is a LOT of money, so I want to be sure I don't regret spending it if I buy the AG-DVC20. On the other hand if it's worth it I don't want to regret NOT spending the extra cash if it makes a difference and my projects come out with a lower final quality than I could have gotten with the better camera.

I'm using Adobe Premiere Elements and FXHome EffectsLabPro on an HP Pavilion a1330n PC. 3800+AMD Athalon 64 Processor, 1.0GB memory, 250GB hard drive, a BFG tech graphics card (In case you need to know)

My goal is to make a feature length film (80min? A DVD) and do music video and short films. I plan to burn DVDs of my movie and distribute them for free. I also want to create a web site where people can download my movie for free in the highest quality format possible and burn their own DVDs for home viewing. (Does this effect my choice?) I made the mistake of NOT doing research before buying my Panasonic VDR-D210 with mini DVD and no mic input. (Sorry, I hadn't discovered INDYMOGUL yet. Now I know the error of my ways!) I would appreciate it if you folks would share your experiences and maybe do a little research in answering my question, especially if you have experience with either or both of these cameras (B&H has all the specs and info on these cameras) I still have a lot to learn about film making want to be sure of my decision before I make my biggest investment in equipment. I'm going to have to live with this decision for a long time...

Thanks!

I almost bought the AG-DVC20 myself but changed my mind due to the size of the camera and because I couldn't find out if there was a tripod mount (since it is supposed to be used as a shoulder mount camera.

I own an older version of PV-GS500 and I love this camera. The picture quality matched a $20,000 camera when mine was used as a back up camera on the feature film, The Road.

For money you're thinking about spending you can get one of the Canon's (that seemed to be loved by a lot of people here) or a Sony HDR-HC7 (I have one of these and love it too).

Just because a camera had HD you don't have to shoot in it though. For the record, the HD projects I have been shooting take up LESS space then SD on my hard drive.

Not that you asked but the camera (other then being 3 CCD or CMOS sensor) spending more money doesn't mean it is a better camera.

Your needs may be better served if you went with a cheaper camera and bought a huge external hard drive to go with it.

I have over 1 terebyte of hard drive space now and this was a better decision then which camera to use.

You should be saving your work on the same hard drive that holds your editing software. My computer performs better and renders faster.

I hope I have been helpful.



BigRedMonster

[UndergroundLairProductions]

I've been thinking of getting a Canon Gl-2 for my first prosumer camera. Anyone else have one? If so, is it worth it?

[KASR]

I've been thinking of getting a Canon Gl-2 for my first prosumer camera. Anyone else have one? If so, is it worth it?


The GL1 and GL2 are both excellent choices for a first pro-sumer camera. It is basic enough to get rolling fast and advanced enough to keep you growing until you are ready for a higher end piece of equipment. Jump in with happiness!

[KASR]

OK, I have hit a brick wall in my movie making and have decided I need a better camera to finish my project. I want to stay in SD format due to editing issues, so I'm not interested in HD right now. I have $1500.00 in my budget which precludes a Cannon GL2 or Panasonic DVX100B. I have been comparing 2 cameras by Panasonic (The problems with the Cannon tape drives scares me) and have come down to these 2 choices.

Panasonic AG-DVC20 - $1250.00
Panasonic PV-GS500 - $700.00

There is little info on this site about the AG-DVC20 and I have only seen 1 thread comparing these 2 cameras. My obvious objective is to get the best video and audio quality for my 1.5K I need the help of the INDYMOGUL gurus to make a decision. Here is what my research has brought me to...

VIDEO
AG-DVC20=3xCCD 1/6" 460,000 pixels
PV-GS500=3xCCD 1/4.7" 1.07 MegaPixel

OK, what does this really mean? (Yes I have been using the SEARCH button!) What am I getting for the extra $550 in the AG-DVC20? And will I notice a difference?

AUDIO
Both cameras have 1/8" stereo inputs. So, is there a difference in the quality of sound I will get? Can I use a shotgun mike with 1/8" stereo output, or do I need to get an XLR converter and use more expensive mics?

MORE TO THINK ABOUT
Both cameras seem to have the same problem of having a lot of controls in the LCD menu instead of being controlled by buttons on the camera. Ray Bittle says the AG-DVC20 was a "Pain in the butt" and advised buying the PV-GS500 and spending the extra $$$ on mics. $550.00 is a LOT of money, so I want to be sure I don't regret spending it if I buy the AG-DVC20. On the other hand if it's worth it I don't want to regret NOT spending the extra cash if it makes a difference and my projects come out with a lower final quality than I could have gotten with the better camera.

I'm using Adobe Premiere Elements and FXHome EffectsLabPro on an HP Pavilion a1330n PC. 3800+AMD Athalon 64 Processor, 1.0GB memory, 250GB hard drive, a BFG tech graphics card (In case you need to know)

My goal is to make a feature length film (80min? A DVD) and do music video and short films. I plan to burn DVDs of my movie and distribute them for free. I also want to create a web site where people can download my movie for free in the highest quality format possible and burn their own DVDs for home viewing. (Does this effect my choice?) I made the mistake of NOT doing research before buying my Panasonic VDR-D210 with mini DVD and no mic input. (Sorry, I hadn't discovered INDYMOGUL yet. Now I know the error of my ways!) I would appreciate it if you folks would share your experiences and maybe do a little research in answering my question, especially if you have experience with either or both of these cameras (B&H has all the specs and info on these cameras) I still have a lot to learn about film making want to be sure of my decision before I make my biggest investment in equipment. I'm going to have to live with this decision for a long time...

Thanks!

BigRedMonster

Kinda on-topic: what brand of videocam did you record the initial footage with? Becuz I would recommend buying the same brand for video consistency. Quite a number of years back, I shot a project with two different cameras: one a canon, the other a sony - and when I got the footage to post-production, the difference was VERY noticeable.

The reason: there is differences between Canon and Sony in the flavor of the video as captured through both camera. Inter-cutting between the two will not go well. Same brand cameras will have more luck, for example: a Canon XL1 and GL1 will cut together seamlessly as will a Sony PD150 and a DSR300.

Just something to consider.

[tambrm1016]

Well, I did it, I just ordered a Canon HV30 with an Azden SMX-10 stereo shotgun mic from B&H. Everything people say about B&H is true. Very nice and professional sales guy on the phone. Recommended some extra stuff without being high pressure. The price on the HV-30 is down to just over $700.00. With the extra stuff I bought my total bill is $1102.00 tax and shipping included.

Thanks to everyone out there who took the time to help me with this decision. Indy mogul is a great community!

BigRedMonster

[tambrm1016]

Kinda on-topic: what brand of videocam did you record the initial footage with? Becuz I would recommend buying the same brand for video consistency. Quite a number of years back, I shot a project with two different cameras: one a canon, the other a sony - and when I got the footage to post-production, the difference was VERY noticeable.

Just something to consider.

I used a Panasonic VDR-D210. Fortunately due to conflicts in everyones schedule we have only shot a few scenes so far. Since I have learned so much since then (December) I really wanted to re-shoot them anyway.

Now we have a fresh start with the HV-30

[KASR]

I used a Panasonic VDR-D210. Fortunately due to conflicts in everyones schedule we have only shot a few scenes so far. Since I have learned so much since then (December) I really wanted to re-shoot them anyway.

Now we have a fresh start with the HV-30


Fresh starts aren't a bad thing! New equipment and you're alittle wiser! Good luck!

[KMProductions]

Well, I did it, I just ordered a Canon HV30 with an Azden SMX-10 stereo shotgun mic from B&H. Everything people say about B&H is true. Very nice and professional sales guy on the phone. Recommended some extra stuff without being high pressure. The price on the HV-30 is down to just over $700.00. With the extra stuff I bought my total bill is $1102.00 tax and shipping included.

Thanks to everyone out there who took the time to help me with this decision. Indy mogul is a great community!

BigRedMonster


Great! I'm glad you found something. Sorry I wasn't much help on this. I have been away for a while with my last week of school. But the HV30 Is a really good camera.

[tambrm1016]

Great! I'm glad you found something. Sorry I wasn't much help on this. I have been away for a while with my last week of school. But the HV30 Is a really good camera.

No problem, I got a lot of great help from the forum. I feel good about my purchase. Expect to see a post about downloading video in SD format next week when the camera comes. I can't wait to start using it.

[Theminorityreport]

Hello!

I am in the process of saving money for a camera. I just graduated from Journalism school and I'm working on launching an internet tv talk show. I have access to a Panasonic camera at school however there is always a scheduling conflict. I am looking for the best camera that is compatible enough to meet my broadcasting needs. I will be using it on shoots for liveshots and standups. Eventually, I am considering a short or two as well as some commercials.

To get started, I have my eye on this camera and would love to know what you think about it.

IT's the Sony HVR HD 1000U

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/images/items/518555.jpg

Here are the specs:

Digital High Definition HDV Camcorder
1080i
Mini DV Compatible
CMOS Sensor
Photo mode
And click on the link for more.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518555-REG/Sony_HVRHD1000U_HVR_HD1000U_Digital_High_Definitio n.html#goto_itemInfo

[KMProductions]

Well when I first saw it and looked at the price it didn't look all that good. But after I read about it, it actually looks like a really good, inexpensive camera. HD, pretty good sensor.

The only problem I see is that their are no XLR inputs. If you want to do a internet TV talk show you would probably want to use hand held microphones that you and another person can hold. The bad part is that most good hand held mics are XLR. You can buy mics that go in with a 1/8 jack (which is what that camera has).

But that is really the only problem I see. It looks like a pretty good camera though.

Feel feel to post or PM me any more question you may have.

[elscottomagnifico]

Well when I first saw it and looked at the price it didn't look all that good. But after I read about it, it actually looks like a really good, inexpensive camera. HD, pretty good sensor.

The only problem I see is that their are no XLR inputs. If you want to do a internet TV talk show you would probably want to use hand held microphones that you and another person can hold. The bad part is that most good hand held mics are XLR. You can buy mics that go in with a 1/8 jack (which is what that camera has).

But that is really the only problem I see. It looks like a pretty good camera though.

Feel feel to post or PM me any more question you may have.

If XLR is a major issue, then one can always get a powered mixer. It will supply phantom power, have an 1/8" or 1/4" output and give much more control over the sound from the mic than a camcorder will. In the negative, it is one more thing to carry around and need power for - but for an internet/tv talkshow, set planning should allow for finding an outlet for the mixer and make moving the setup a small problem.

[DanielImpsonProductions]

The Canon ZR200 has the best internal microphones I've ever heard, that's the only reason I still use it.

[Vermilion films]

i was thinking about buying a canon xh a1, sony hdv fx1 or a panasonic hvx 200. i can spend up to about $3000 maybe a little higher. i looking for a camera that i can use for a long time. I'm planing on going to cal arts next year and want something i can use there as well. i wanted to know what's the big difference between these cameras also what separates them from from cameras in the 3 digit price range?

[KMProductions]

Well the panasonic you mentioned is 2 Grand over what you want to spend so I'll compare the other two. Ultimately though the Panasonic is probably better.

I think the Canon is the better one. The video quality is the same on both but the canon has more input and outputs, specifically XLR, which you will probably want. There really isn't that much difference in the two cameras but I would buy the Canon if it were me.

The big difference between these cameras and ones you see at walmart for 200-1000 USD is mainly quality of the image and the camera itself. All these cameras you mentioned are 3CCD. The camera has 3 microchips that take in more color and light than a regular 1CCD, which is what you mostly get for 3 digit prices. Read my original post on page 1 for more details about this. Also more expensive cameras have more manual settings that allow you to customize you image more, getting a more specific result. Adjustable frame rates, iris controls, focus, AE, white balance, and gain.

I hope I helped and if you have any more questions feel free to ask or send me a PM.

[tambrm1016]

OK, I followed your advice and bought an HV30 on the precept that I could shoot in HDV format and download in SD.

Now I can't.

MY HV30 does not seem to want download in a format different than what was recorded in.

(See my thread "Help with my new HV30)

Can anyone help?



Thanks!

[ChristopherJ]

I was going to buy a Canon GL2 camcorder, but apparently I can't get one anywhere. I live in the UK (not sure if it has anything to do with it) and when I search for the Canon GL2 in Google, I can't find ANY UK sites that are still selling this camera. I don't understand why, it was on Amazon.co.uk like last week, but I waited to do extra research, decided to order and BOOM it's gone (at least as far as I can see).

I was just browsing the net, looking for alternatives, and I just clicked on this Sony camera for fun, the SonyHVR-HD1000E, and since i have no REAL knowledge on if cameras are good, i was wondering if the Mogulers could save me from mistakes once again.

Or if you could suggest any cameras like it for around £1000 - £1500 (I dont know how much that is in $s)

[elscottomagnifico]

I believe it's called the XM2 for PAL countries (The GL2 is the NTSC version)

By the looks of it, the cam has been discontinued - so you may have just fallen past the point of excess stock being sold.

[nooneimportant77]

cal arts doesn't have a camera you can use?

[alex3540]

Anyone want to give a quick comparison of the HV30 and the HG10? Or just a quick summary of MiniDV vs HDD cameras?

Keep in mind I have a slightly older version of Final Cut (5.1.4) that I am going to be working with.

[KMProductions]

I'd say mini DV is the best way to go. Especially with a Mac. So HV30.

[evilottojr]

My friend has a real nice camera, to the point of even having
Survivorman-quality nightvision.
The only problem is that it shoots in Hi8, and it has no computer output jacks.
Any suggestions?

[KMProductions]

My friend has a real nice camera, to the point of even having
Survivorman-quality nightvision.
The only problem is that it shoots in Hi8, and it has no computer output jacks.
Any suggestions?

I would suggest a new camera. You would need other equipment to import the footage, and I'm really not even sure how to do that.

[Ciaran]

My mum and sister put money together to get me a camera for christmas. They bought me a Sony MiniDV Handycam DCR-HC27E, but it sadly has no mic jack port on it. I was thinking of buying another one that does come with a mic jack port, but I'm not sure what to get. I'm pretty poor at the moment, but aren't most teenagers? I'd need something reasonably priced, though if it comes down to it, I'm willing to save up, but I don't really want to spend over £500, as a maximum of £500 would take me a while to save, anyway.

Any recommendations?

[Jason Endurance]

Just purchased a used Canon XL1s for 860 bucks. I heard it's very comparable to the GL2 and was used to film Full Frontal and 28 Days Later.

Sound like a deal?

[KMProductions]

Just purchased a used Canon XL1s for 860 bucks. I heard it's very comparable to the GL2 and was used to film Full Frontal and 28 Days Later.

Sound like a deal?

Sorry but the XL1 is nothing like the XL2.
I use a XL1 at church and I own a XL2. They aren't much alike.


For a small inexpensive camera I would look at the Canon ZR800. It's the first camera in my original post on page 1. It has a mic input and it's what a lot of people here use. It is about 150 USD. I'm not sure what that is in Euros.

[Jason Endurance]

Sorry but the XL1 is nothing like the XL2.
I use a XL1 at church and I own a XL2. They aren't much alike.


For a small inexpensive camera I would look at the Canon ZR800. It's the first camera in my original post on page 1. It has a mic input and it's what a lot of people here use. It is about 150 USD. I'm not sure what that is in Euros.

The ZR800 is below what I'm currently using now. And there is also a HUGE difference between the XL1 and the XL1s.

Besides...I was outbid last second. Boo-urns. Ah well, got my sights set on the Panasonic something or other, haha. Can't remember the exact model at the moment due to pain killers, but its the one everyone is raving about over the GL2.

[KMProductions]

The ZR800 is below what I'm currently using now. And there is also a HUGE difference between the XL1 and the XL1s.

Besides...I was outbid last second. Boo-urns. Ah well, got my sights set on the Panasonic something or other, haha. Can't remember the exact model at the moment due to pain killers, but its the one everyone is raving about over the GL2.


Yeah, the first section of my post was directed toward you. The second part was for the guy before you. Also I thought you said that the XL1 was compairible to the XL2. You said GL2 though. So for that I would not know. I've never used a GL2. I assume their somewhat alike though.

haha sorry for all that confusion. I should have made the post directions more clear

[Manga Monkey]

Does anyone know of a good but cheap camera that sends videos to a Mac without a driver?
Thanks,
Bye!

[KMProductions]

Any Mini DV camera will transfer video fine. Just use iMovie or FCE/P. And use the capture function.

[Andrew-kun17]

Does the aiptek aHD have a mic input or the 1080?

[DuLt]

I'm sorry if this has been asked before, but I found out about the Red one (http://www.red.com/) and was wondering how good that really is/could be?
Is it worth saving up for that to shoot "indie/homie/low-budgety" movies? Or the ammount of acessories needed would make us sell our feet?
I especially like the concept behind 3K...

Again, sorry if this has been asked before, but I didn't found a specific thread for it...
Also, please don't give me the "That's not low budget" speach... A person may invest in such camera in order to keep it forever and ever and ever (until the next best thing comes out in 3 years) and still make low budget movies (depends on what we need anyway).

[KMProductions]

I'm sorry if this has been asked before, but I found out about the Red one (http://www.red.com/) and was wondering how good that really is/could be?
Is it worth saving up for that to shoot "indie/homie/low-budgety" movies? Or the ammount of acessories needed would make us sell our feet?
I especially like the concept behind 3K...

Again, sorry if this has been asked before, but I didn't found a specific thread for it...
Also, please don't give me the "That's not low budget" speach... A person may invest in such camera in order to keep it forever and ever and ever (until the next best thing comes out in 3 years) and still make low budget movies (depends on what we need anyway).

The red one is an amazing camera. I have never even been able to use one so I don't know to much about it, but the tech specs say it's amazing. I'm not sure if you have to buy different accessories like recording decks and lenses and stuff but if you willing to spend the money I'd say go for it.


And don't worry, I would never give the "That's not low budget" speech. I would say that if you not willing to invest thousands of dollars in filming then you don't really like to do it.

[KMProductions]

Does the aiptek aHD have a mic input or the 1080?

It does not have a mic input and although it shoots in 1280 x 720 it's not true HD.

[thepunkesh]

Does the aiptek aHD have a mic input or the 1080?

ahd is inferior than the new action hd from aiptek.

aiptek action hd (http://www.aiptek.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=HDV21X&Category_Code=WN1&Store_Code=AS) says its 1080p, but is in fact 1440x1080( as in 4:3 not full 1080p which is 16:9). it also shoots 720p at 30fps and 60fps. it's a hybrid; it shoots 5-8mp stills too.only 3x optical zoom.

hd quality is good for $200, but if you can spend more than $600, you can do way better.no mic input.

here's a review (http://forums.steves-digicams.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=589966&forum_id=92)with video samples
__________________________________________

if you can't spend much more than that, then wait for dxg 596 (http://www.dxgtech.com/product_jpg/DVH596.jpg). full 1080p, 5x optical zoom, 720p@60fps, still no mic input. no word on quality. price will be below $250.

[DuLt]

The red one is an amazing camera. I have never even been able to use one so I don't know to much about it, but the tech specs say it's amazing. I'm not sure if you have to buy different accessories like recording decks and lenses and stuff but if you willing to spend the money I'd say go for it.


And don't worry, I would never give the "That's not low budget" speech. I would say that if you not willing to invest thousands of dollars in filming then you don't really like to do it.

I'm trying to cover all basis.

I like the 3k because it already has 8x zoom and it can record ond other formats (less storage space needed) so it's useful not only for filming (in 5 years, 3 will be average I believe...).

Also I never filmed a big movie, just A project for college (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdM0NOR-nbc). I really liked it and wanted to work on other projects... horror movies, psicotic thrillers, B-rated stuff.
But! Like most things in life I have no... time (thought I would say money... that's not my main concern, I'm good at budgeting things).
So the 3K would serve as a high quality film camera, a good "holiday" camcorder and a good tool for audiovisual works... Though I would also need to get a good enough tv/projector...

[KMProductions]

ahd is inferior than the new action hd from aiptek.

aiptek action hd (http://www.aiptek.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=HDV21X&Category_Code=WN1&Store_Code=AS) says its 1080p, but is in fact 1440x1080( as in 4:3 not full 1080p which is 16:9). it also shoots 720p at 30fps and 60fps. it's a hybrid; it shoots 5-8mp stills too.only 3x optical zoom.

hd quality is good for $200, but if you can spend more than $600, you can do way better.no mic input.

here's a review (http://forums.steves-digicams.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=589966&forum_id=92)with video samples
__________________________________________

if you can't spend much more than that, then wait for dxg 596 (http://www.dxgtech.com/product_jpg/DVH596.jpg). full 1080p, 5x optical zoom, 720p@60fps, still no mic input. no word on quality. price will be below $250.


yeah personally, I would go for a 3CCD camera with a mic input than an "HD" camera that doesn't have a mic input and records to a card. I would save up for a while longer and get something a little nicer.

Just my opinion.

[thepunkesh]

yeah personally, I would go for a 3CCD camera with a mic input than an "HD" camera that doesn't have a mic input and records to a card. I would save up for a while longer and get something a little nicer.

Just my opinion.


i agree, but 3ccd is outta my budget (prove me wrong...please). i've been seduced by the hd quality:ohsnoes:(so crisp). so much potential for post(with good lighting)!

above the aiptek/dxg bottom-of-the-barrel quality/pricing, there is sanyo xacti hd700 (http://forums.steves-digicams.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=580340&forum_id=27) ($400-450) & hd1000 (http://forums.steves-digicams.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=577679&forum_id=27) ($575+ or $494 at pref.photo??? (http://www.preferredphoto.com/viewproduct.aspx?ID=3727041&l=Froogle))i know the hd1000 has mic input, headphones out. still flash. still auto. anyway $500 is my limit. any other options under $500ish:fcross:?anyone?!?

this is one of those things where the more $ugar you put in, the $weeter it gets!!! (old india-n proverb)

[KMProductions]

The HD1000 looks pretty good, but be warned that it has no optical zoom. Only digital. That means whenever you want to zoom it will probably be pixelated. But generally it looks pretty nice.

You said you wanted me to prove you wrong so here you go. A 3CCD camera under $400. (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/477103-REG/Panasonic_PVGS320_PV_GS320_3_CCD_Mini.html) Though the chips are small and there is no mic input. I would go for which ever one you think you can use better and afford. I just wanted to let you know about that camera.

Here (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/415307-REG/Panasonic_PVGS500_PV_GS500_3_CCD_Mini_DV.html) is another one but is a little more than you said you wanted to spend. This one is a lot nicer and has bigger chips and a mic input.

I hope I helped

[Andrew-kun17]

It does not have a mic input and although it shoots in 1280 x 720 it's not true HD.

Thanks. do you know of any cameras that records to SD card with mic input for 200-250 max? it doesnt have to be HD. and does the sanyo in the episode with Alan K?

[KMProductions]

Thanks. do you know of any cameras that records to SD card with mic input for 200-250 max? it doesnt have to be HD. and does the sanyo in the episode with Alan K?

Sorry man, I actually could not find one for that price range. I'll keep looking around though.

[jamie the lizard]

i am a lizard

[Andrew-kun17]

Sorry man, I actually could not find one for that price range. I'll keep looking around though.
Thanks any way but are there any with great video and audio quality? I wwas thinking about gettin an aiptek aHD or Sanyo xacti i think 720 (the one alan k has in his episode). I leaning towards the sanyo.

[Andrew-kun17]

Thanks any way but are there any with great video and audio quality? I wwas thinking about gettin an aiptek aHD or Sanyo xacti i think 720 (the one alan k has in his episode). I leaning towards the sanyo.
no wait I just watched it. its a Sanyo C40

[thepunkesh]

Thanks. do you know of any cameras that records to SD card with mic input for 200-250 max? it doesnt have to be HD. and does the sanyo in the episode with Alan K?


the closest to your budget, and mine for that matter, is the Cannon FS100 @ amazon for $334 on sale (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-FS100-Memory-Camcorder-Advanced/dp/B00114LG7U). search for fs100 on vimeo for samples (here's one with chinese kids dancing at church (http://www.vimeo.com/1179740)...the dude's got some awesome moves.) looks to be pretty good for sd quality and price, nice zoom, and records on flash memory. and of course, the rarest of rare, mic input+headphone jack combo.

[thepunkesh]

The HD1000 looks pretty good, but be warned that it has no optical zoom. Only digital. That means whenever you want to zoom it will probably be pixelated. But generally it looks pretty nice.

You said you wanted me to prove you wrong so here you go. A 3CCD camera under $400. (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/477103-REG/Panasonic_PVGS320_PV_GS320_3_CCD_Mini.html) Though the chips are small and there is no mic input. I would go for which ever one you think you can use better and afford. I just wanted to let you know about that camera.
+
I hope I helped

it does help. thanks. i even saw test footage, and you're right. 3ccd, even with small chips, looks way better than other SD. this will certainly go on my consideration list(top of my SDcam list). i'm not buying one for a while.the research continues though. found another potential sub300 with mic input and hd:

Digilife DDV-V3HD (http://www.digilifeglobal.com/DDV-V3HD.htm); 720p,mic+headphone jacks, but of course it hasn't made it to production yet. looks just like an xacti. another bottom of the barrel find.

[KMProductions]

it does help. thanks. i even saw test footage, and you're right. 3ccd, even with small chips, looks way better than other SD. this will certainly go on my consideration list(top of my SDcam list). i'm not buying one for a while.the research continues though. found another potential sub300 with mic input and hd:

Digilife DDV-V3HD (http://www.digilifeglobal.com/DDV-V3HD.htm); 720p,mic+headphone jacks, but of course it hasn't made it to production yet. looks just like an xacti. another bottom of the barrel find.

Cool, good luck on finding your camera and if you have any more questions feel free to ask.:D

[Jason Endurance]

Bah, ended up buying a used GL2 on ebay for 1000 bucks...should come in the mail in a few days. Kinda excited. Right now I'm only using a 3CCD Panasonic PVGS320. It does the job, and I've even used it for a high paying job shooting videos for a college website, but it doesn't look professional.

How's everyone liking theirs? I hear there is a universal problem with the line...something to do with the rewind...but thankfully I use a dV cassette rewinder.

[Vermilion films]

ok KMP i got a good one for you.

the panasonic dvx100B vs. the sony hdr fx1

first of all im an indy filmmaker fresh out of high school looking for a camera that i can use for the next couple of years that will give me that great film look. im planing on going to cal arts next year so i want something i can use while im attending college. i also only have about $2,500 to spend.

I have been trying to choose between these two cameras for the last 2 or 3 week here what ive found out. the dvx films in 24p standard while the fx1 films in 1080i hdv. the panasonic has great low lighting abilities and xlr inputs (which is very important to me) but if i can can buy xlr inputs for the fx1 right?

someone also told me to look at the canon xl2 (which still doesn't shoot in hdv and seems too big and bulky to me)

so which should i buy or is there an amazing camera in my price range that fits all my requirements that im forgetting?

[KMProductions]

Jason:

I use an XL2 (the GL2's big brother) and I love it. I haven't had any problem with it. But I'm glad you found a camera. Was it used?

[KMProductions]

Vermillion: Well to start off the XL2 and the FX1 are both out of your price range.

Honestly I wouldn't worry too much about HD. Unless you can burn in HD DVDs then I don't see much point. I would go for the DVX 100. It has the same size CCD as the FX and it shoots in 24p.

[Jason Endurance]

Jason:

I use an XL2 (the GL2's big brother) and I love it. I haven't had any problem with it. But I'm glad you found a camera. Was it used?

Yup, used.

[KMProductions]

Yup, used.

cool. have fun with it.:D

[Jason Endurance]

cool. have fun with it.:D

Thanks...it's due to arrive a week from today!

[KMProductions]

THIS IS A TEST TO SEE IF I CAN GO TO PAGE 16

[ChristopherJ]

THIS IS A TEST TO SEE IF I CAN GO TO PAGE 16

Well done young traveler, you have made it to the fabled page 16.... but ye be warned... the journey to page 17 and beyond may not be so easy.....:ohsnoes:

And now my phase of craziness has passed, i can carry on with what i wanted to say in the first place.


This thread is of course about video cameras, as there isn't really much use for picture cameras when making videos unless it's using it for stop motion.

I was just wondering, what should i look for when wanting to be a Digital SLR camera?

[KMProductions]

Well done young traveler, you have made it to the fabled page 16.... but ye be warned... the journey to page 17 and beyond may not be so easy.....:ohsnoes:

And now my phase of craziness has passed, i can carry on with what i wanted to say in the first place.


This thread is of course about video cameras, as there isn't really much use for picture cameras when making videos unless it's using it for stop motion.

I was just wondering, what should i look for when wanting to be a Digital SLR camera?

uh, I'm sorry I know nothing about SLRs. Sorry I can't help you much here.

[ChristopherJ]

I think i may just go ahead and buy a random one that i find when i go out today, just so i can get to grips with them, even if it's not a very good one.

[elscottomagnifico]

I think i may just go ahead and buy a random one that i find when i go out today, just so i can get to grips with them, even if it's not a very good one.
What do you want in a DSLR. The main makers are Canon and Nikon, but the specific camera will come down to what you want it to be able to do. Do you want "live-view" (it's where you see what the camera sees on the screen and not just the viewfinder - think point and shoot style)?

Also, what is your budget?

[ChristopherJ]

I've bought a Nikon D40 DSLR camera from where i work, as a guy that works there told me that it was a good camera to start with (he does a lot of photography and has exhibitions, so i thought it was a safe bet listening to him)

I didn't exactly know what i wanted it for. I would love a career in photography but i don't know where to start. I think just playing around with the camera and trying to get some good shots of random things will be my first step :P

[elscottomagnifico]

For a starter cam, the D40 should do well. In the price range you're down to the Canon XT or the Nikon D40 and between the two it's up to preference (and the D40 is a little cheaper). A bit more ($200 ish) would have gotten you up to the range of a canon XTI or the Nikon D60 which which will grow along with you as you learn a little better, but the D40 should be a good entry into DSLR photography.

[DarkForestFilms]

i've been looking at the sony DSR-PD150.
it seems like a really good camera. I've found it for $1500, and thats what i'm saving up for.

[elscottomagnifico]

i've been looking at the sony DSR-PD150.
it seems like a really good camera. I've found it for $1500, and thats what i'm saving up for.
It is a nice camera. Excellent lowlight, good audio (xlr) in a prosumer SD cam. If I remember right, Jackass and some other tv shows/movies were shot on one. You just might want to look at the reliability and legitimacy of your $1500 source because that sounds much lower than it should be.

[ChristopherJ]

Look around different places first! Don't make the mistake of looking online, finding a really cheap price and setting that as your goal, as a few things could happen in the time it takes you to get your money.

1. It could come off the website, and the low price was just a clearance price until they were all sold.
2. The website could not have much stock in the cameras, and when they do they will bump up the price.
3. It could be one of those websites that rip you off, you never get your item and you never hear from them again and can't find them again.


These are just random things that i've heard people complaining to me about. They may not apply to your situation.

Look around different websites to get higher prices, and kind of set an average cost that you should be aiming for, that way you could just go to a different supplier if the cheaper website doesn't have it in stock!

[ResaleValue]

I have the Canon HV20
And it rocks!
It has a beautiful picture, and some prosumer level features like audio level control, 24p, and aperature & framerate control.
plus it has MF and a (3.5mm) microphone in jack!
~and~
favorably records to miniDV which is the *preferable* media :D

i'm planning on getting a RODE video mic to pair it with!

p.s.- HV30= HV20+ 30p+ larger zoom rocker+ black

[KMProductions]

I have the Canon HV20
And it rocks!
It has a beautiful picture, and some prosumer level features like audio level control, 24p, and aperature & framerate control.
plus it has MF and a (3.5mm) microphone in jack!
~and~
favorably records to miniDV which is the *preferable* media :D

i'm planning on getting a RODE video mic to pair it with!

p.s.- HV30= HV20+ 30p+ larger zoom rocker+ black

cool, um glad you like it.

[KMProductions]

Look around different places first! Don't make the mistake of looking online, finding a really cheap price and setting that as your goal, as a few things could happen in the time it takes you to get your money.

1. It could come off the website, and the low price was just a clearance price until they were all sold.
2. The website could not have much stock in the cameras, and when they do they will bump up the price.
3. It could be one of those websites that rip you off, you never get your item and you never hear from them again and can't find them again.


These are just random things that i've heard people complaining to me about. They may not apply to your situation.

Look around different websites to get higher prices, and kind of set an average cost that you should be aiming for, that way you could just go to a different supplier if the cheaper website doesn't have it in stock!


Yeah, a few good site that you can really trust are B&H and J&R. Those are the 2 big ones that wouldn't ruin their business by ripping you off. Amazon gets it's stock from other companies so be sure to check those stores out before you click "buy" from Amazon.

[KMProductions]

i've been looking at the sony DSR-PD150.
it seems like a really good camera. I've found it for $1500, and thats what i'm saving up for.


I can't find many people who sell it. Amazon doesn't even have it, they just have what they call a "demo". Anyway, I would seriously re-look at the $1500 deal you saw. I can't even find a used one that cheap. If you don't mind, can you give me the link to where you saw that.

[FilmMakerGuru]

I really hate the fact that you have to really look hard for consumer cams that have a mic input, I for one can't afford a professional model.

[KMProductions]

I really hate the fact that you have to really look hard for consumer cams that have a mic input, I for one can't afford a professional model.

I know what you mean. It just the fact that most people who buy a consumer camera or something that they sell at Best Buy or something, they will just use it for filming birthdays, sports games and other stuff. Not for filmmaking.

[Black Dawn Productions]

ok KMP i got a good one for you.

the panasonic dvx100B vs. the sony hdr fx1

first of all im an indy filmmaker fresh out of high school looking for a camera that i can use for the next couple of years that will give me that great film look. im planing on going to cal arts next year so i want something i can use while im attending college. i also only have about $2,500 to spend.

I have been trying to choose between these two cameras for the last 2 or 3 week here what ive found out. the dvx films in 24p standard while the fx1 films in 1080i hdv. the panasonic has great low lighting abilities and xlr inputs (which is very important to me) but if i can can buy xlr inputs for the fx1 right?

someone also told me to look at the canon xl2 (which still doesn't shoot in hdv and seems too big and bulky to me)

so which should i buy or is there an amazing camera in my price range that fits all my requirements that im forgetting?


Here's a cool three way shoot out i found between Canon XL2 (currently own this one), FX1, and the DVX

http://dvxuser.com/articles/shoot3/

If you're going for film look here's an excerpt about it.


"An observer watching the footage from the three cameras might say:
FX1 (on high-def monitor): “Wow, that’s sharp video!”
DVX: “That looks like a movie!”
XL2: “Did you shoot this on film? It looks like it might be film…”

[mopman]

this guide is still pretty small, I think you need to put a little more detail in and not just use information from the forums, look stuff up from reviews and stuff. also you should mention the red-one

[KMProductions]

this guide is still pretty small, I think you need to put a little more detail in and not just use information from the forums, look stuff up from reviews and stuff. also you should mention the red-one

Thanks for the suggestions. I never just use info from the forums. For every camera I take a look at the specs on B&H. But I will definitely add more.

[mopman]

thanks, I am sure you are busy and probably have better things to do than maintain a thread on a forum but just to help newer people, maybe add some info like frame rate options, the quality of video, and maybe a link to a sample video so people can see what kind of quality they will be getting from their footage

[KMProductions]

thanks, I am sure you are busy and probably have better things to do than maintain a thread on a forum but just to help newer people, maybe add some info like frame rate options, the quality of video, and maybe a link to a sample video so people can see what kind of quality they will be getting from their footage


Awesome thanks. It may be a bit, for some reason I've been swamped with other stuff to do. The only hard part about linking to sample video is that most of it will be on youtube whos quality sucks. So you really can't see anything.

[mont]

I was thinking of buying Panasonic DVX100B, but I was wondering if someone knows a camera like this, which shoots HD.

[SobchakSecurity]

I've been pondering over buying either the Canon HG10 or the Canon HF100 for the past week but I still have a few questions about them.

After looking through their specs on Amazon both cameras seem to offer the same picture quality and many similar features however:

The HG10 has an accessory shoe while the HF100 has a mini-accessory shoe which leads me to believe I would have to buy specialized attachments for the HF100 while the HG10 would accept all "standard" attachments that fit a standard accessory shoe? (That's just a guess, feel free to correct me)

Also, the HF100 features 30p mode. What are the benefits of this mode and in your opinion would it be worth sacrificing the 40gb HDD to obtain 30p? (

[Ringlord]

For my birthday this year I got a aiptek HD cam corder. It shoots a great picture and it was only 150$! But there is a problem. Theres only one editing soft ware That I can find that will reconize the camera. Its called Arc-soft total media extreme it came with the camera but its terrable. It takes like five miniutes to merge any videos togther. I cant use chroma keying and it only burns to dvd's blu ray and hd dvds. If you no of any other software it will run with please tell me thanks!

[KMProductions]

For my birthday this year I got a aiptek HD cam corder. It shoots a great picture and it was only 150$! But there is a problem. Theres only one editing soft ware That I can find that will reconize the camera. Its called Arc-soft total media extreme it came with the camera but its terrable. It takes like five miniutes to merge any videos togther. I cant use chroma keying and it only burns to dvd's blu ray and hd dvds. If you no of any other software it will run with please tell me thanks!

Well, you need to go in and take the files off of the card. When you plug it up does it appear in "my computer"?

[KMProductions]

I was thinking of buying Panasonic DVX100B, but I was wondering if someone knows a camera like this, which shoots HD.

The DVX100 is a great camera. I would rather get the DVX. then to find a HD camera. I don't think you can find a HD DVX100. You could always look at the Canon HD products.

Here are the Canon ones
Canon XH-A1 (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/447098-REG/Canon_1191B001_XH_A1_3CCD_HDV_Camcorder.html)
Canon XH-G1 (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/447096-REG/Canon_1629B001_XH_G1_3CCD_HDV_Camcorder.html)
Canon XL-H1 (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/402800-REG/Canon_0967B001_XL_H1_3_CCD_High_Definition.html) There are different variant of this camera.

[KMProductions]

I've been pondering over buying either the Canon HG10 or the Canon HF100 for the past week but I still have a few questions about them.

After looking through their specs on Amazon both cameras seem to offer the same picture quality and many similar features however:

The HG10 has an accessory shoe while the HF100 has a mini-accessory shoe which leads me to believe I would have to buy specialized attachments for the HF100 while the HG10 would accept all "standard" attachments that fit a standard accessory shoe? (That's just a guess, feel free to correct me)

Also, the HF100 features 30p mode. What are the benefits of this mode and in your opinion would it be worth sacrificing the 40gb HDD to obtain 30p? (


30p is just a different framerate and recording style. Instead of shooting at 60i, which would be recording the even fields first 1/60 of a second and then recording the odd fields at the second 1/60 of a second, it records the whole frame every 1/30 of a second.

The HG10 will be better quality than the HF100. But the HF has 30p.

My opinion would be to get the HG10. More space, better quality, a full hot (and cold) shoe. It just seems like the better deal.

Hope I helped.

[SobchakSecurity]

Awesome. Thanks for the advice. HG10 shall be mine!

[D.M.I-Productions]

i film with the hv30 and i am a big fan i once used the gl2 (great too) but but i could not see the difrance between the two and i heard the hv20 i much alike but i dont exactly know i never used it but im sure it is great too

[KMProductions]

i film with the hv30 and i am a big fan i once used the gl2 (great too) but but i could not see the difrance between the two and i heard the hv20 i much alike but i dont exactly know i never used it but im sure it is great too

What? I cant even understand what your question is. Punctuation is a good thing, use it.

[C2Films]

I have a camcorder to add!

The Panasonic HDC-SD1.
It has 3 1/4" CCDs, optical image stabilization, a 5.1 channel surround sound microphone, a microphone input, shoots in HD, records onto flash memory, and is available for less than $500.

[punkandska66]

OK, I'm getting an HV30 soon. But I wanted to know if there are rivals in the price range. I mean I've heard that it's amazing and stuff, but there are also some complicated things about it. Like the trick with the SD card for aperture settings, I don't understand it. I like that it has threads for filters and stuff though. It has mic. input, and headphone outputs, and it's great, but is there anything better? I have $1,500.000 (USD) But I also need to buy a mic, and a solid, fluid head tripod, and if I get the HV30, then I need tapes. The only thing I can think of is the GL-1. Which is 1,200. Then I can spend 150 on a mic and 150 on a tripod, or more likely: about 75 on a mic, and closer to 200 something for a tripod.

And the HV20 is the same price as the HV30 right now, otherwise I would get the HV20 instead of the 30 and save a couple hundy.

[KMProductions]

OK, I'm getting an HV30 soon. But I wanted to know if there are rivals in the price range. I mean I've heard that it's amazing and stuff, but there are also some complicated things about it. Like the trick with the SD card for aperture settings, I don't understand it. I like that it has threads for filters and stuff though. It has mic. input, and headphone outputs, and it's great, but is there anything better? I have $1,500.000 (USD) But I also need to buy a mic, and a solid, fluid head tripod, and if I get the HV30, then I need tapes. The only thing I can think of is the GL-1. Which is 1,200. Then I can spend 150 on a mic and 150 on a tripod, or more likely: about 75 on a mic, and closer to 200 something for a tripod.

And the HV20 is the same price as the HV30 right now, otherwise I would get the HV20 instead of the 30 and save a couple hundy.


Personally I would keep saving until I could get a GL2, but I'll recommend one of the options you gave me.

A GL-1 is about 1,200 like you said, I wouldn't buy one if you saw it for under 1000 USD. Anything that is super cheap can't be good. Once again, personally, I wouldn't buy a used GL-1. I just don't think it is wise to buy something that is that expensive, used. Unless you personally know the seller.

So I would get the HV30 along with a good condenser shotgun mic and a nice tripod. The sunpacs tripods at Wolfe Camera are pretty nice.

Hope I helped

[punkandska66]

Personally I would keep saving until I could get a GL2, but I'll recommend one of the options you gave me.

A GL-1 is about 1,200 like you said, I wouldn't buy one if you saw it for under 1000 USD. Anything that is super cheap can't be good. Once again, personally, I wouldn't buy a used GL-1. I just don't think it is wise to buy something that is that expensive, used. Unless you personally know the seller.

So I would get the HV30 along with a good condenser shotgun mic and a nice tripod. The sunpacs tripods at Wolfe Camera are pretty nice.

Hope I helped

Yes you helped. Thanks. I was thinking about saving for the GL2, but I have heard that the HV20/30 actually rivals the GL2. So I don't really know if it's worth it.
And there's no way I'm going for a used GL1 or a cheap one from some scam site. But I heard GL1's have lots of problems anyways (which were fixed in the GL2).


http://hv20.com/showthread.php?t=13411 (hv30 vs gl2)

[elscottomagnifico]

OK, I'm getting an HV30 soon. But I wanted to know if there are rivals in the price range. I mean I've heard that it's amazing and stuff, but there are also some complicated things about it. Like the trick with the SD card for aperture settings, I don't understand it. I like that it has threads for filters and stuff though. It has mic. input, and headphone outputs, and it's great, but is there anything better? I have $1,500.000 (USD) But I also need to buy a mic, and a solid, fluid head tripod, and if I get the HV30, then I need tapes. The only thing I can think of is the GL-1. Which is 1,200. Then I can spend 150 on a mic and 150 on a tripod, or more likely: about 75 on a mic, and closer to 200 something for a tripod.

And the HV20 is the same price as the HV30 right now, otherwise I would get the HV20 instead of the 30 and save a couple hundy.In the price range, the HV doesn't really have any rivals. The HV with a slew of extras (tripod, lights, mic, boom, headphones, etc.) will outdo the GL2. The GL2 is a nice entry-level SD prosumer cam, but it isn't any sort of unbeatable amazing camera.

The only thing the HV won't be able to compare to with the GL is manual control, but the SD-card trick is actually pretty easy to use. In reality you're just using the still photo button to check aperture, shutter, etc. while you're setting the exposure option.

[punkandska66]

In the price range, the HV doesn't really have any rivals. The HV with a slew of extras (tripod, lights, mic, boom, headphones, etc.) will outdo the GL2. The GL2 is a nice entry-level SD prosumer cam, but it isn't any sort of unbeatable amazing camera.

The only thing the HV won't be able to compare to with the GL is manual control, but the SD-card trick is actually pretty easy to use. In reality you're just using the still photo button to check aperture, shutter, etc. while you're setting the exposure option.

OK, so what you're saying is that the GL2 is pretty good, but nothing revolutionary. Where as the HV20/30, with the resolution that it has, combined with good technique, lighting sound, and other production value can do just as well as the GL2 or better. Also, thanks for reminding me Scotto, I also have to buy lights and gels. So you guys think that for the price range the HV30 is the best bet as far as cameras go within $700.00-$1,000.00 (more or less).
Also, I am used to HDD so some things about tape: I know that I can use SD tapes for an HD camera, so I wouldn't spend more than I need to. But, for getting footage on to the computer: hard or easy, fast or time consuming. Should I use Sony tapes with a Canon camera (because Canon doesn't make tapes), or does it not matter, because I know that the past 10 years or so tapes have all been made the same way. Most importantly: How much will it cost me, if I want to make decent length films?

[bobaandy1]

Most people don't realize you can get an older professional studio camera (such as the DXC-M7, and everything near its time) for like $300 on Ebay. They usually have very poor low light performance, but 100% on-camera manual controls and very good picture in well-lit area.

[kenkyusha]

But, for getting footage on to the computer: hard or easy, fast or time consuming. Should I use Sony tapes with a Canon camera (because Canon doesn't make tapes), or does it not matter, because i nthe past 10 years or so tapes have all been made the same way. Most importantly: How much will it cost me, if I want to make decent length films?
Uploading footage from tape to deck/computer is 1 - 1, so if you shoot 1 full hour (1 tape) it will take that long (unless you are using FCP- you can batch capture with that, getting only the footage you want). Be aware that high definition footage is HUGE, so you may also have to shell-out for some additional storage (an external firewire, E-sata drive, or a RAID).

The recommendation re: tapes from the (really knowledgeable) folks over at the HV site- it doesn't matter what you use, but pick one type and stay with it. HTH.

Be well,
Jigme

[KMProductions]

OK, so what you're saying is that the GL2 is pretty good, but nothing revolutionary. Where as the HV20/30, with the resolution that it has, combined with good technique, lighting sound, and other production value can do just as well as the GL2 or better. Also, thanks for reminding me Scotto, I also have to buy lights and gels. So you guys think that for the price range the HV30 is the best bet as far as cameras go within $700.00-$1,000.00 (more or less).
Also, I am used to HDD so some things about tape: I know that I can use SD tapes for an HD camera, so I wouldn't spend more than I need to. But, for getting footage on to the computer: hard or easy, fast or time consuming. Should I use Sony tapes with a Canon camera (because Canon doesn't make tapes), or does it not matter, because i nthe past 10 years or so tapes have all been made the same way. Most importantly: How much will it cost me, if I want to make decent length films?



The GL2 is a good camera but ,yeah, it's nothing revolutionary. It's a good entry level camera that is pretty expandable. You can get stuff like New Lenses (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/310h5-3rGBL._SL500_AA280_.jpg) and Better inputs (http://www.pictureline.com/images/medium/DV1020_8032A002AA.jpg). (click links) It depends on whether or not you thing saving for a GL2 is worth it.

About the importing stage: My XL2 was my first MiniDV and it's not a hard switch. It all imports in real time so if you shoot 15 it takes 15 minutes to import. It's about 10-13 GB per hour of SP footage. Every video program will be able to import with ease. All you need is firewire (http://www.research.att.com/%7Esuresh/blog/files/firewire_cable_6_4-3.jpg). So importing wont be a problem. Also it doesn't matter what brand of tapes you get. Just get the good ones. Sony has a few different kinds. (standard, premium, excellent.)

[punkandska66]

It all imports in real time so if you shoot 15 it takes 15 minutes to import. It's about 10-13 GB per hour of SP footage. Every video program will be able to import with ease. All you need is firewire (http://www.research.att.com/%7Esuresh/blog/files/firewire_cable_6_4-3.jpg). So importing wont be a problem. Also it doesn't matter what brand of tapes you get. Just get the good ones. Sony has a few different kinds. (standard, premium, excellent.)

10-13 gigs? Wow, that's a lot. But I guess considering it's HD and all...

So 1-1 importing, I guess I can live with that. Cause with my camera now, I can have an hour of footage on the computer in less than 5 minutes. That's not HD, and it's HDD though so...

Well I guess editing will take a bit longer and I'll have to shell out some money for an exernal hard drive then.

Say I have a 10 minute movie. With raw footage that's like 3 gigs or something? When I render it, it will be a lot smaller yeah? So I could delete the clips but keep the final rendered version and it'd take up a lot less space. Oh I gotta find out if Vegas renders HD.

[KMProductions]

10-13 gigs? Wow, that's a lot. But I guess considering it's HD and all...

So 1-1 importing, I guess I can live with that. Cause with my camera now, I can have an hour of footage on the computer in less than 5 minutes. That's not HD, and it's HDD though so...

Well I guess editing will take a bit longer and I'll have to shell out some money for an exernal hard drive then.

Say I have a 10 minute movie. With raw footage that's like 3 gigs or something? When I render it, it will be a lot smaller yeah? So I could delete the clips but keep the final rendered version and it'd take up a lot less space. Oh I gotta find out if Vegas renders HD.


The Home version I know doesn't even edit HD. But the GL2 isn't HD. It's just pretty high quality SD. But HD video will take up more space.

[punkandska66]

Crud, the home version won't edit HD!? But it said on the box it does HD, I think. Well that's kind of a problem isn't it?

[bobaandy1]

It does HD. Dunno what yoour talking about. I've has no problems with vegas movie studio platnium.

The GL2 continutes to amaze me even after many years. Great camera.

[KMProductions]

It does HD. Dunno what yoour talking about. I've has no problems with vegas movie studio platnium.

The GL2 continutes to amaze me even after many years. Great camera.

The platinum version does edit HD. I said the home version.

Anyway punkandska: Like I said the GL2 is SD and the HV30 can shoot in SD, so you shouldn't have a problem.

[elscottomagnifico]

There really aren't resolutions for tapes. HD or regular mini-dv tapes are exactly the same technologically. The "HD" tapes are just quality checked more - it's more of a marketing scheme to sell you a $10 tape that works the same as a $3 tape.

You can use either Sony or Panasonic tapes. The lubrication issue (dry vs. wet) isn't a problem anymore because Sony changed to match other tapes. It's just a good idea to pick one company and stick with their tapes to "play it safe". Also, you should get a head cleaning tape from the same maker as your mini-dv tapes (only use it when you are having drop out/recording issues - think of it as a repair, not a routine maintenance).

If you have the extra cash, you can look into getting the unboxed version of Vegas Pro from B&H for $130 - if you need a more advanced editor, that is.

[punkandska66]

The platinum version does edit HD. I said the home version.

Anyway punkandska: Like I said the GL2 is SD and the HV30 can shoot in SD, so you shouldn't have a problem.


Oh OK, whew. Cause the the full name is "Home studio platinum" or something like that.

Ok, so I can edit HD, sweet.

[punkandska66]

If you have the extra cash, you can look into getting the unboxed version of Vegas Pro from B&H for $130 - if you need a more advanced editor, that is.

What's the difference between that and the full pro version? Also I might be able to get the pro version with a student discount.

EDIT:Oops, sorry for the double post.

[KMProductions]

What's the difference between that and the full pro version? Also I might be able to get the pro version with a student discount.

EDIT:Oops, sorry for the double post.


The Pro version does multi-camera selections, better color correcting, 5.1 surround sound encoding and placement, just some more functions like that. I don't really know all of them.

[punkandska66]

So is it worth getting the unboxed version if I already have the Platinum Home version?

[KMProductions]

So is it worth getting the unboxed version if I already have the Platinum Home version?

I really can't answer that, because I haven't used both. Just the pro version.

[C2Films]

Are you going to add the camcorder I posted on page 19?

[KMProductions]

Are you going to add the camcorder I posted on page 19?

Yeah, I've written down some cameras that I'm going to add and yours is the first one on the list.:D

[jetpack]

don't forget the Canon XL-2 , it way better than the GL-2

[elscottomagnifico]

don't forget the Canon XL-2 , it way better than the GL-2
Definately should be added - but in a "high-end" section (for the cams most don't consider very affordable).

The GL2 is nice and all, but it gets much more credit than it should around these forums. The GL2 is the entry level prosumer (the little bro of the top tier, so to speak), while the XL2 is the high end prosumer.

It's the same setup as Panasonic with the DVC30 as the entry prosumer SD cam, compared to the DVX100 which is the high end prosumer cam.

[nooneimportant77]

The GL-2 does get a lot of credit around here, I used to use it A LOT and I got good results around it, but I found it to be a pretty basic camera.

On another note- I would really recommend the Sony HDR-HC7, I own one, and I get really good results out of it. Lots of manual control- shutter speed, exposure, focus, zebras, a histogram, and some other nice things.

It gets me really nice clean shots that make for really great color work later, and can get very low DOF. With the right settings there's no need to zoom or anything, careful focus, and a few other things and it's golden. If anyone has any questions about the cam let me know, and I'll answer em.

[KMProductions]

don't forget the Canon XL-2 , it way better than the GL-2

Dont worry, this camera is on my list too. I own a XL2 so I will be able to speak from personal experience when I add it.


Also: Sorry if it has been taking a long time to add cameras that you have requested. I haven't had much time to be on the forums and look up the cameras lately.

[elscottomagnifico]

So is it worth getting the unboxed version if I already have the Platinum Home version?
The unboxed version is Vegas Pro. It is much nicer than Platinum. The unboxed version just doesn't come with a shiny box, a printed manual (it's online though) or a separate DVD making program (which can be picked up cheap if you need one). Other than that, it is the full Vegas 8 Pro.

[4D-Magician]

Does anyone have experience with the JVC gz-hd7?
I hear a lot of different opinions about this cam. I just want it to make movies for myself, not for pro stuff. I'm mainly interested in this one because it has an manual focus ring.

Are there people here who can tell me their experience with it? I'm using premiere pro 7.0, is it a problem to imort footag with it?

[KMProductions]

I just took a quick look at the specs. It looks like a good camera to me. It is hard drive though, so you will have to use a software that will come with the camera to import. Then bring that footage into your editing software.

[punkandska66]

The unboxed version is Vegas Pro. It is much nicer than Platinum. The unboxed version just doesn't come with a shiny box, a printed manual (it's online though) or a separate DVD making program (which can be picked up cheap if you need one). Other than that, it is the full Vegas 8 Pro.

SO I get the WHOLE vegas 8.0? I just don't get a box. They lower it like 350 dollars just because it doesn't come in a box?! I think I'll be getting this... eventually.

[elscottomagnifico]

SO I get the WHOLE vegas 8.0? I just don't get a box. They lower it like 350 dollars just because it doesn't come in a box?! I think I'll be getting this... eventually.
Yes you get the WHOLE Vegas Pro 8. There just is no included DVD Architect, no box and no printed paperwork/manual. Just look for a copy of DVD Architect (or something similar), find the manual online (or on the disk - Sony includes it on the disk with the program) and accept the fact that most everyone throws away the box anyway.

The pricing gap caught me by surprise too (I mean, it's a mass produced box, paperwork and a DVD program you can pick up for less than $100).

[punkandska66]

Well I already have DVD architect and I keep the box for pretty much any software that I get. But you're right, a lot of people throw it away. But that's a HUUUGE price gap.

[CindyLynn]

I use a Canon XL-2 and its available for $1500 -- shoots in 24p and is over-all a great camera!!

You could even grab a what I like to call an "xl2 in a smaller box," the GL2 for $600
http://shopdigitaldirect.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=7668 (http://shopdigitaldirect.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=7668)

[KMProductions]

I use a Canon XL-2 and its available for $1500 -- shoots in 24p and is over-all a great camera!!

You could even grab a what I like to call an "xl2 in a smaller box," the GL2 for $600
http://shopdigitaldirect.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=7668 (http://shopdigitaldirect.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=7668)

yeah, I use a XL2 as well. Though I wouldn't trust anyone who sells a new one for $1500. They just don't come that cheap. The GL2 is also a good camera though not exactly the caliber of a XL2. It's a little lower quality, with 3 1/4 CCDs rather than 3 1/3. And the GL2 doesn't have quite as many functions. Honestly I wouldn't buy a GL2 for $600 either. Places that sell new stuff that cheap can always be trusted.

When I was shopping for my XL2 I found a website that had it for $1500. I called to see if it came with the lens because I new that it probably didn't. Somebody answered and I asked if their XL2 came with a lens and they just hung up. I called again and ask and they hung up again. I called a 3rd time and somebody different answered. I asked my question again (extremely pissed off) and the guy said no and then hung up. So you can't always trust places.

[cubes]

Has anyone checked out the new Panasonic AG-HMC70? Just wanted to see what opinions you guys had if any. Seems like a decent piece, records to SD, 16:9, XLR and BNC connections, full audio control.

[KMProductions]

Has anyone checked out the new Panasonic AG-HMC70? Just wanted to see what opinions you guys had if any. Seems like a decent piece, records to SD, 16:9, XLR and BNC connections, full audio control.

It looks like a decent camera. Pretty professional looking but personally I probably wouldn't spend 2 grand on it. You can get something comparable for about the same price that isn't as big and heavy. I would save a little more and get a DVX100. I also don't really like the whole recording onto cards thing. I would rather have a DV tape that you know is good quality and not easy to loose.

[elscottomagnifico]

Has anyone checked out the new Panasonic AG-HMC70? Just wanted to see what opinions you guys had if any. Seems like a decent piece, records to SD, 16:9, XLR and BNC connections, full audio control.
I'm looking more toward the AG-HMC170 to bring AVCHD to the point of matching (or possibly exceeding) mini-dv compression.

http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Panasonic-Aims-for-an-AVCHD-Future-with-AG-HMC150-34499.htm

It is essentially an HD DVX100 for a new age. As such, it is priced accordingly.

[A non-complex Username]

what about the JVC GZ-HD7 ?
I'd like to buy it, but its just to expensive!!!
:supermad: :supermad: :supermad: :supermad:

[4D-Magician]

Me too, although it's not too much mony for me, i'm just not sure if it's a good cam, because of the many different opinions on it.

[D.M.I-Productions]

What? I cant even understand what your question is. Punctuation is a good thing, use it.
srry i am very sloppy:teehee:

[serch86]

Hi, I will buy a new camera soon, and I don't decide yet wich one I'll buy. The ones I think are the best choices are the Canon HV 30, Sony Handycam HDR-HC9 and the Panasonic PV-GS500, but I'm not sure wich one to buy, prices are similar, buy Im really new at this so I need help please

[KMProductions]

Hi, I will buy a new camera soon, and I don't decide yet wich one I'll buy. The ones I think are the best choices are the Canon HV 30, Sony Handycam HDR-HC9 and the Panasonic PV-GS500, but I'm not sure wich one to buy, prices are similar, buy Im really new at this so I need help please


They are all pretty much the same actually. Same manual controls, and pretty much the same quality. The HV30 and the HDR-HC9 both shoot in HDV, which is kinda HD. A lot of people on these forums use a Canon HV30. It's a really popular camera. So I would choose between the Canon and Sony. The Sony is a little more expensive but it's a little beefier. So I'm gonna recommend the Canon or Sony. Whatever you feel like spending.

[CindyLynn]

You'll have to put the Sony HVR-HD1000U in. In my opinion, its an HV20 in a professional body.

I don't want to sound like a Aptek fanatic, but I think the "Aptek A-HD" or something like it should be added to the list. IT DOES shoot in HD and is only $130.

[KMProductions]

You'll have to put the Sony HVR-HD1000U in. In my opinion, its an HV20 in a professional body.

I don't want to sound like a Aptek fanatic, but I think the "Aptek A-HD" or something like it should be added to the list. IT DOES shoot in HD and is only $130.

It doesn't shoot true HD. Everybody is always like "zomg it shoots HD!!!!" but not true HD. That is why that camera is not comparable to a Canon XL-H1.

[elscottomagnifico]

It doesn't shoot true HD. Everybody is always like "zomg it shoots HD!!!!" but not true HD. That is why that camera is not comparable to a Canon XL-H1.
HDV cams (like the XL-H1) also don't technically shoot true HD resolution (1440 instead of 1920 wide - still 1080 tall though). Some will let you get the full res out from HDMI though - just doesn't record to tape. It's the same setup as SD cams though - there is no actual widescreen on SD cams, the pixels are compressed width-wise on tape to fit normal SD and then restreched later(it's the 1.33 aspect ratio change you have to select on editors).

The Aiptek is not the best for the list for other reasons - bad lens, compression artifacts, bad sound, 720P at full resolution - so more near SD than HD (compression issues are more obvious at full res on variable resolution choice cams also).

[serch86]

They are all pretty much the same actually. Same manual controls, and pretty much the same quality. The HV30 and the HDR-HC9 both shoot in HDV, which is kinda HD. A lot of people on these forums use a Canon HV30. It's a really popular camera. So I would choose between the Canon and Sony. The Sony is a little more expensive but it's a little beefier. So I'm gonna recommend the Canon or Sony. Whatever you feel like spending.

Thanks for the help :)

[Explosion Mainiac]

They are all pretty much the same actually. Same manual controls, and pretty much the same quality. The HV30 and the HDR-HC9 both shoot in HDV, which is kinda HD.

What do ya mean by "kinda HD". Is it not true HD? I'm thinking about getting one.

[elscottomagnifico]

What do ya mean by "kinda HD". Is it not true HD? I'm thinking about getting one.
It shoots 1440 instead of 1920. The pixels are stretched on the computer to match 1920. It's not a major difference, so you won't notice it - the 1920 video stream would take more space and a much more complicated compression setup to render out the same video quality (even HDD cams that say they do full 1080i have it at a cost on compression - motion rendering issues/artifacts, ghosting).

[Explosion Mainiac]

Ahhh. Thanks a lot.

[KMProductions]

Yep, He pretty much explained it well.

[Eight Legged Freak]

I was thinking of buying a fabled Canon HV20/30. I was looking at the specifications, however and it says it doesn't export using Firewire, instead using USB and HDMI.

This true? Do I need to buy a HDMI-compatible video card to capture footage. Because I heard USB capturing really takes the quality down. And it does seem like a stable camera, much better than my JVC GR-D750.

EDIT: So I rechecked and it seems FireWire is termed interchangibly with 'DV', didn't know that. Other questions still stand; can I capture footage with HDMI cables? Does it improve quality?

[elscottomagnifico]

I was thinking of buying a fabled Canon HV20/30. I was looking at the specifications, however and it says it doesn't export using Firewire, instead using USB and HDMI.

This true? Do I need to buy a HDMI-compatible video card to capture footage. Because I heard USB capturing really takes the quality down. And it does seem like a stable camera, much better than my JVC GR-D750.

EDIT: So I rechecked and it seems FireWire is termed interchangibly with 'DV', didn't know that. Other questions still stand; can I capture footage with HDMI cables? Does it improve quality?You can capture via HDMI. If you are capturing from the tape, it won't improve quality at all - with digital video, the info either gets transfered or doesn't. If you capture a live feed via HDMI, then the quality will increase - no HDV compression, full 1080 HD. Check out HV20.com for full info, opinions and methods of capturing HDMI.

[Eight Legged Freak]

You can capture via HDMI. If you are capturing from the tape, it won't improve quality at all - with digital video, the info either gets transfered or doesn't. If you capture a live feed via HDMI, then the quality will increase - no HDV compression, full 1080 HD. Check out HV20.com for full info, opinions and methods of capturing HDMI.
Thanks for the information. This camera does everything.

[EnipProductions]

Erm wheres the Canon XH A1.

Amazing camera, its like prosumer version of the HV20/30 with interchangable lenses and awesome set of manuel controls (I used one myself)

[KMProductions]

Erm wheres the Canon XH A1.

Amazing camera, its like prosumer version of the HV20/30 with interchangable lenses and awesome set of manuel controls (I used one myself)


I'll add that if you want. The Canon XH A1 is a jacked up version of the HV. I wouldn't really compare the two. Anyway I add it soon.

[elscottomagnifico]

Erm wheres the Canon XH A1.

Amazing camera, its like prosumer version of the HV20/30 with interchangable lenses and awesome set of manuel controls (I used one myself)
The XH A1 doesn't have interchangable lenses. It has a 3ccd setup, many more manual controls and XLR capability, but not interchangable lenses. It has a thread for additional lenses and filters, but so does the HV - maybe that's what you were thinking of.

It's the XL-H1 that has interchangable lenses.

[EnipProductions]

Whoops I got confused :).

And weres the Red option on here :D

[SmiJa]

Well when I first saw it and looked at the price it didn't look all that good. But after I read about it, it actually looks like a really good, inexpensive camera. HD, pretty good sensor.

The only problem I see is that their are no XLR inputs. If you want to do a internet TV talk show you would probably want to use hand held microphones that you and another person can hold. The bad part is that most good hand held mics are XLR. You can buy mics that go in with a 1/8 jack (which is what that camera has).

But that is really the only problem I see. It looks like a pretty good camera though.

Feel feel to post or PM me any more question you may have.

well if you need to add XLR connectors to a camera you can always go with a beachtek box. they mount right to the bottom of the camera. Thease things are grate. I plan on getting one when I get the sony hvr-HD1000U.

Here is a link to the beachtek products on B&H:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?ci=0&shs=beachtek&sb=ps&pn=1&sq=desc&InitialSearch=yes&O=jsp%2Fproduct.jsp&A=search&Q=*&bhs=t&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=submit

and here is the link to the beachtek website:
http://www.beachtek.com/

[KMProductions]

Enip: Like I said in my original post, I'm not going to be adding any super big cameras because if you want to spend 5 grand on a camera you need to research it on your own.

[EnipProductions]

I know it was a joke hence thee :D

But the Scarlet could be up there soon

[SmiJa]

I just thought I might add on the whole thing about Hi-8, right now I currently have a samsung miniDV and a Sony Hi-8. the both have a 1/6" CCD but the samsung has a higher amount of pixels. Although the Sony has better image quallity. Do any of you find that a little weird.

[elscottomagnifico]

I just thought I might add on the whole thing about Hi-8, right now I currently have a samsung miniDV and a Sony Hi-8. the both have a 1/6" CCD but the samsung has a higher amount of pixels. Although the Sony has better image quallity. Do any of you find that a little weird.If it's a sony that uses Hi-8 tapes, it might be a Digital 8 cam. They use the old Hi-8 tapes but provide full digital video at the same SD resolution of comparable mini-dv cams. You can tell it's Digital 8 if the cam has firewire/DV port for hooking up to your computer.

Now, onto image quality. There is no single thing that will make image quality inherintly better. More resolution does not give better quality, just more pixels (those pixels may or may not work well together). Digital does not give better quality in itself (it's just a system of recording, analogue can record well - it's just easier to have interference and problems with analogue). Chip size does not give better image quality alone (low light ability, maybe, but not necessarily overall image quality).

As such, an HD cam is not always better than an SD cam. A 1/4" chip cam is not always better than a 1/6" cam. A 3CCD cam is not always better than a CMOS cam. A Digital cam is not always better than an analogue cam. It's all in the specific setup.

Alone, they are all just meaningless specs. Mix the right group together and you have amazing image quality.

[ibend1]

hey... i have a question... is having one cmos sensor or 3 ccd chips better?

[ChristopherJ]

What file type does the Canon HG10 HDD camera save the footage as? I was thinking about buying one of these but some people say the footage is really hard to make it so it can be used in editors, and others say it's real easy.


Edit: I've seen that the Canon HG10 saves onto the hard drive in MTS files (i think, i've been looking on different forums so i could be wrong). How difficult is it to work with these file types?

[KMProductions]

hey... i have a question... is having one cmos sensor or 3 ccd chips better?

3 CCDs.

[KMProductions]

What file type does the Canon HG10 HDD camera save the footage as? I was thinking about buying one of these but some people say the footage is really hard to make it so it can be used in editors, and others say it's real easy.


Edit: I've seen that the Canon HG10 saves onto the hard drive in MTS files (i think, i've been looking on different forums so i could be wrong). How difficult is it to work with these file types?

I used my friends JVC HDD camera once and we shot some stuff but we couldn't get it on my computer because they were these weird file types. HDD cameras come with a software that accepts that file type. Just import it with that software and convert to a file type that your editor will accept. Other than that, I don't know what kind of file it is.

[ChristopherJ]

So hopefully if i buy one of those HDD camcorders, i won't have too much trouble getting it on to the laptop / computer so i can add in my effects and edit things... thanks :)

Also, the Canon HG10 allows for an external mic to be plugged in, would that mean there is a seperate port for the mic, or would it be something to do with the hot / cold shoe?

[ibend1]

ok.... waht are some cheap ('bout 1000 buck) cameras that have 3ccd rather than one cmos. one cmos seems more common for things like the hv30 and such

[KMProductions]

So hopefully if i buy one of those HDD camcorders, i won't have too much trouble getting it on to the laptop / computer so i can add in my effects and edit things... thanks :)

Also, the Canon HG10 allows for an external mic to be plugged in, would that mean there is a seperate port for the mic, or would it be something to do with the hot / cold shoe?

There will be a 1/8" Stereo mini jack. It's the size of a headphone jack.