View Full Version : Schools violating rights?
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 08:50 PM
At my brother's middle school, the principals are allowed to look through a student's cell phone and can punish them if they say something bad in it. For example, A girl was suspended today because she was talking bad about some other girl. Now, to me, this seems like their rights are being violated. Even if their phone is off, the administrators can turn it on and look through it. Do you think this is an abuse of power/rights? Discuss.
HoboSmackTalk777
05-20-2008, 08:52 PM
what?! that's total bullshit? You could bring it up before the education board...
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 08:54 PM
I am really pissed about it and I don't even go there. It is total bullshit, you're right. I'm moving in a month or so and I don't even know when the board of education has meetings.
WesScog
05-20-2008, 08:54 PM
Not really, a Supreme Court case determined that students basically give up their rights while attending Public School, so no, it's totally legal.
Gestapo, privacy invading, bull-crap, but legal gestapo, privacy invading, bull-crap.
Everyone should just delete all of the text messages on their cell phones, and talk bad VERBALLY about people behind their backs.
Kid's have been doing it for thousands of years with no problem, no reason to bring a cell phone into the mix as far as i'm concerned.
PreviewOfThePast
05-20-2008, 08:54 PM
well at my school, when they take up your phone or camera, or w/e they always look through it and you get talked to by the school rent-a-cops if there is something bad on it
also, if a phone goes off during a test, no matter what class, everyone's test becomes invalid
:supermad:
ClayOgre
05-20-2008, 09:00 PM
...the legacy of Columbine and similar events...
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 09:04 PM
...the legacy of Columbine and similar events...
A school shooting doesn't give schools the right to go through personal property. When a cell phone is off and is taken away, there is no logical explanation for an administrator to turn it on and look through it.
At my school, Administrators are only allowed to look through personal property that isn't visible unless they have probable cause like a drug dog sniffed out your locker.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 09:15 PM
Theres alot of stuff in the news in Ireland right know about cyber bullying and how schools can help when its outside of the school. This way it only makes sense that they look for such things on a phone when its confiscated. Mind you there could be other personal stuff on there! But yet again I'm impartial on this subject because yere laws dont affect me, just thought I'd give my 2 cents.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 09:25 PM
I understand the bit about cyber bullying but it just bothers me they can look through personal belongings without permission.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 09:31 PM
I'm not sure about yere school rules but we are allowed have our phones as long as they are turned off (you can turn them on when not in class). If your phone goes off in class it is kind of your own fault.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 09:32 PM
They are supposed to turn it off when they get to school but nobody does. I understand them taking it away if it goes off but they still don't have any right to look through it.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 09:37 PM
Most people in my school dont turn there phones off either.
I kind of agree with you (of course I wouldn't like my teachers going through my phone) but you have to look at it from their point of view. If they stopped something bad happening do you think it would be worth it?
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 09:41 PM
If it's just along the lines of cyber bullying then I would rather have my privacy but if it's something really bad, like a shooting, I guess so.
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 09:48 PM
I don't see a huge problem with going through the phones. It is bullshit that they can just go through it, but you shouldn't have them out.
What I DO have a problem with, is that you can get in trouble for talking trash about someone. Generation Y are such pussies.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 09:51 PM
Well, you have to think. How many (shootings in your case) suicides would be the result of bullying. Personally I take bullying in my stride but there are people who really take nasty stuff that people say to heart, and its not just a case of "just grow some nads and get on with life" some people have issues or are in really bad situations.
If this conversation were to really develop I'd be playing devils advocate, but thats the kind of person I am, I rarely take sides!
_ray_biddle_
05-20-2008, 09:52 PM
At my brother's middle school, the principals are allowed to look through a student's cell phone and can punish them if they say something bad in it. For example, A girl was suspended today because she was talking bad about some other girl. Now, to me, this seems like their rights are being violated. Even if their phone is off, the administrators can turn it on and look through it. Do you think this is an abuse of power/rights? Discuss.
Kids shouldn't have cellphones in school but this is BS.
jawahunter
05-20-2008, 09:54 PM
Kids shouldn't have cellphones in school but this is BS.
I'm going to have to agree and I don't get why people don't delete what they send if they don't want anyone seeing what they're writing? It's the same as writing notes in class and sending it around and the teacher reading it aloud, just in the digital age. It's been happening forever.
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 09:57 PM
Well, you have to think. How many (shootings in your case) suicides would be the result of bullying. Personally I take bullying in my stride but there are people who really take nasty stuff that people say to heart, and its not just a case of "just grow some nads and get on with life" some people have issues or are in really bad situations.
If someone is willing to take their own life, or someone else's, as a result of what somebody said about them, they've got much bigger issues than bullies.
Saying that suicides and shooting are a result of bullying, in my humble opinion, is complete bullshit.
Citrus
05-20-2008, 09:58 PM
That is really stupid. People at my school only take them away and nothing else. I'm one of the good ones who keep their phone off and in their locker unless it has to be out (possible family emergencies and such). I think you should talk to the board about this or have someone talk to them.
Steve Nelson
05-20-2008, 10:01 PM
That sucks, Wes...can you source that? This seems a little over the edge. Going through cell phones? I dunno...I haven't been in high school in almost 3 years...and man have things changed.
jawahunter
05-20-2008, 10:02 PM
Saying that suicides and shooting are a result of bullying, in my humble opinion, is complete bullshit.
You seriously need to read this. (http://stcharlesjournal.stltoday.com/articles/2007/11/24/news/sj2tn20071110-1111stc_pokin_1.ii1.txt) Now.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 10:03 PM
If someone is willing to take their own life, or someone else's, as a result of what somebody said about them, they've got much bigger issues than bullies.
Exactly my point, when people have issues bullying and such can be worse to them then it seems to others, making there issues worse. bullying mightn't often be the cause but it sure doesn't help.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 10:05 PM
You seriously need to read this. (http://stcharlesjournal.stltoday.com/articles/2007/11/24/news/sj2tn20071110-1111stc_pokin_1.ii1.txt) Now.
I live there. So heard all about that.
Kids shouldn't have cellphones in school but this is BS.
Well...cells are okay. Parents should just make sure they buy the ones without the camera-phone or texting features....camera-phones are trouble in the hands of a high schooler.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 10:13 PM
Well...cells are okay. Parents should just make sure they buy the ones without the camera-phone or texting features....camera-phones are trouble in the hands of a high schooler.
Um, I'm in high school and almost everybody I know has a camera phone. What kind of trouble do you speak of? I can't think of any at the moment.
ciwi286
05-20-2008, 10:16 PM
Um, I'm in high school and almost everybody I know has a camera phone. What kind of trouble do you speak of? I can't think of any at the moment.
A huge problem here is people filming fights or people being bullied/ embarassing moments and sending it round the school. It eventually ends up on the internet.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 10:18 PM
A huge problem here is people filming fights or people being bullied/ embarassing moments and sending it round the school. It eventually ends up on the internet.
That isn't a problem at my school. People just myspace bad stuff to each other. lolz
Um, I'm in high school and almost everybody I know has a camera phone. What kind of trouble do you speak of? I can't think of any at the moment.
My senior year of high school we made the news because a group of 25-or-so freshman girls decided to send nude photos of themselves to a few guys-who sent them to other people-who sent them to more people. Most of the students in my school had these photos before the school threatened to charge seniors (18 or over) with possession of child pornagraphy if these photos were found on our phones. The girls, other than being publically humiliated, didn't get in trouble.
jawahunter
05-20-2008, 10:20 PM
Um, I'm in high school and almost everybody I know has a camera phone. What kind of trouble do you speak of? I can't think of any at the moment.
I for one can use less of those pictures on the internet of two people standing next to eachother taken by one of the people holding the camera higher than the subjects' heads and both looking at it (if white girls are involved, bad gang signs (http://youtube.com/watch?v=KKTDRqQtPO8) are usually included).
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 10:21 PM
My senior year of high school we made the news because a group of 25-or-so freshman girls decided to send nude photos of themselves to a few guys-who sent them to other people-who sent them to more people. Most of the students in my school had these photos before the school threatened to charge seniors (18 or over) with possession of child pornagraphy if these photos were found on our phones. The girls, other than being publically humiliated, didn't get in trouble.
That's called stupidity. That doesn't have anything to do with camera phones being bad.
That's called stupidity. That doesn't have anything to do with camera phones being bad.
Lack of them would have saved my school, and those girls, a lot of humiliation.
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 10:26 PM
You seriously need to read this. (http://stcharlesjournal.stltoday.com/articles/2007/11/24/news/sj2tn20071110-1111stc_pokin_1.ii1.txt) Now.
Wow, some insecure, suicidal, sheltered girl with ADD killed herself. It MUST have been the bullying.
Seriously, when you have a girl that talks about killing herself since she was THREE years old, that ends up actually doing it, what did you expect?
I hate to say it, but even the "last message she saw" was a bit tame compared to some of the things that get said, and she just couldn't cope. She had her heart broken for the first time, and instead of moving on like the rest of us, she killed herself. T
Her parents held on too tight, and when the first bit of negativity was presented to her, she couldn't handle it. There's obviously other things wrong with her than this dramatized bullying that would push her to kill herself.
Ladri.
05-20-2008, 10:28 PM
Lack of them would have saved my school, and those girls, a lot of humiliation.
Humiliation? They are the ones that sent the pictures in the first place. That's called stupidity and they got what was coming to them.
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 10:28 PM
Lack of them would have saved my school, and those girls, a lot of humiliation.
You're telling me no one at that school had email or myspace accounts?
screamingdeathpunchpictures
05-20-2008, 10:29 PM
Not really, a Supreme Court case determined that students basically give up their rights while attending Public School, so no, it's totally legal.
Gestapo, privacy invading, bull-crap, but legal gestapo, privacy invading, bull-crap.
Everyone should just delete all of the text messages on their cell phones, and talk bad VERBALLY about people behind their backs.
Kid's have been doing it for thousands of years with no problem, no reason to bring a cell phone into the mix as far as i'm concerned.
Holy fuck are you serious? I must ally my anarcho-nihilist friends to attack the fascist swinez!
jawahunter
05-20-2008, 10:32 PM
Wow, some insecure, suicidal, sheltered girl with ADD killed herself. It MUST have been the bullying.
Seriously, when you have a girl that talks about killing herself since she was THREE years old, that ends up actually doing it, what did you expect?
I hate to say it, but even the "last message she saw" was a bit tame compared to some of the things that get said, and she just couldn't cope. She had her heart broken for the first time, and instead of moving on like the rest of us, she killed herself. T
Her parents held on too tight, and when the first bit of negativity was presented to her, she couldn't handle it. There's obviously other things wrong with her than this dramatized bullying that would push her to kill herself.
Hey, you know that point thing the kids are all raging about today? Yeah, you missed it.
You see, no one in the story actually figured the girl would kill herself. She had been showing progress in her personal life and mental status.
Well here comes reality crushing down. Most of the people who suffer from severe depression and similar mental issues don't display it on the outside. And when a bully comes along and picks on a person who's insecure and they decide to commit suicide that bully can't hide behind the excuse of "oh well I didn't know any better".
Yes, a bully on a well adjusted human being will not affect them to make horrible decisions but a bully preying on the weak (even if they don't know they're weak) is potentially sentencing someone to death.
And here's an update to that story. The mother who was the ringleader of it all has finally been charged. So it turns out people who uphold the law believe maybe, just maybe, bullying is a lot more harmful than it appears on the outside to a well adjusted individual.
screamingdeathpunchpictures
05-20-2008, 10:35 PM
Rally to me undevolved ubermensches for we shall hunt the imperial swine with our robots!
C2Films
05-20-2008, 10:42 PM
I recommend password locking your phone, hiding it, or... not bringing it (gasp!).
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 10:43 PM
Hey, you know that point thing the kids are all raging about today? Yeah, you missed it.
You see, no one in the story actually figured the girl would kill herself. She had been showing progress in her personal life and mental status.
Well here comes reality crushing down. Most of the people who suffer from severe depression and similar mental issues don't display it on the outside. And when a bully comes along and picks on a person who's insecure and they decide to commit suicide that bully can't hide behind the excuse of "oh well I didn't know any better".
Yes, a bully on a well adjusted human being will not affect them to make horrible decisions but a bully preying on the weak (even if they don't know they're weak) is potentially sentencing someone to death.
And here's an update to that story. The mother who was the ringleader of it all has finally been charged. So it turns out people who uphold the law believe maybe, just maybe, bullying is a lot more harmful than it appears on the outside to a well adjusted individual.
Really? No one thought she might end up killing herself? I don't know, but when a three year old talks about suicide, and "Battles depression" I might take that as a hint.
And my point was, even if the whole incident would have never happened, something would have pushed her over the edge eventually. People kill themselves for all kinds of reasons, maybe we could just ban everything that might make somebody depressed.
Besides, this is one girl.
jawahunter
05-20-2008, 10:47 PM
And my point was, even if the whole incident would have never happened, something would have pushed her over the edge eventually. People kill themselves for all kinds of reasons, maybe we could just ban everything that might make somebody depressed.
Besides, this is one girl.
There's a world of difference between something randomly setting this girl off and someone pushing to her past the edge. Mainly because one should be murder and one is happenstance. And let's not forget the fact she was IMPROVING meaning that without outside influence she probably would have not committed suicide.
And this is not one girl. This girl is an example of all the children in the world who deal with these kind of issues every day and can't cope because of people like you who have the attitude of "well they would have offed themselves eventually. Who cares if Bob helped? They clearly weren't right in the head."
NaziActionFigure
05-20-2008, 10:59 PM
And let's not forget the fact she was IMPROVING meaning that without outside influence she probably would have not committed suicide.
Exactly, we should just ban outside influence.
This girl is an example of all the children in the world who deal with these kind of issues every day and can't cope because of people like you who have the attitude of "well they would have offed themselves eventually.
Hahaha!
screamingdeathpunchpictures
05-20-2008, 11:02 PM
I'm with Nazi action figure. Let's ban reality!
BinBinProductions
05-20-2008, 11:36 PM
This girl in my math, texts with her legs crossed so the teacher cant see, and she is a senator. LOL
But if you have your cell phone out, teachers dont care, but if you have it out in front of the VP or Principal, they take it, you have to have a parent pick it up.
Steve Nelson
05-21-2008, 01:36 AM
Cell Phones aren't a terrible thing. There were plenty of times when I was stranded at my school and having a phone either got me a ride home or not having one led me to walk home...and I lived a long walking distance from school. It's a nice thing to have.
As far as people being suicidal goes, you know...even if someone is kidding around, it can be taken the wrong way by someone on the edge. There's not much you can do there but offer love and support, and try to make that person feel special...because they are. But, you can't go after kids for being kids. I mean, that's just a part of life. There really isn't too much to say there. All you can do is pay attention to the one in need of it...and that's the responsibility of parents/loved ones/teachers/administrators.
The problem I find, not only in schools, but in the "adult world" is that our authorities and those who love to tell us of their high moral ground are usually people who react to situations. They don't do anything to prevent it. Punishing a bully isn't going to save a suicidal kid.
JackLawrence
05-21-2008, 04:14 AM
At my school you're allowed mobile phones, and if you it rings in class you're just asked to turn it off.
sohanlon10
05-21-2008, 04:45 AM
Yeah, that is really BS, it may be legal "Technically", but it is as if the school is bypassing the "search without a warrent" rule isn't it?:(
Anyway, just becaues it is "legal" it doesn't necissarily make it right.
sohanlon10
05-21-2008, 04:49 AM
Cell Phones aren't a terrible thing. There were plenty of times when I was stranded at my school and having a phone either got me a ride home or not having one led me to walk home...and I lived a long walking distance from school. It's a nice thing to have.
As far as people being suicidal goes, you know...even if someone is kidding around, it can be taken the wrong way by someone on the edge. There's not much you can do there but offer love and support, and try to make that person feel special...because they are. But, you can't go after kids for being kids. I mean, that's just a part of life. There really isn't too much to say there. All you can do is pay attention to the one in need of it...and that's the responsibility of parents/loved ones/teachers/administrators.
The problem I find, not only in schools, but in the "adult world" is that our authorities and those who love to tell us of their high moral ground are usually people who react to situations. They don't do anything to prevent it. Punishing a bully isn't going to save a suicidal kid.
Hear, hear!
Cell phones as of right now are mearly tools. Tools can be used for good or bad reasons. It is up to the individual to decide which path to take, and to accept the potential conciquences for his actions.
An object is not in itself bad, it all depends on how YOU use it.
Steve Nelson
05-21-2008, 01:07 PM
Hear, hear!
Cell phones as of right now are mearly tools. Tools can be used for good or bad reasons. It is up to the individual to decide which path to take, and to accept the potential conciquences for his actions.
An object is not in itself bad, it all depends on how YOU use it.
Allz I said is they aren't terrible and are nice to have. I pass no judgement on phones, except by how they assist me. Although I have a feeling I'm going to have cancer on my right thigh...as it vibrates even when my phone is not in my pocket. But, maybe I'm just suffering from "Phantom Phone". And I've also heard about all the bees dying because of phones!!!
You're telling me no one at that school had email or myspace accounts?
I'm sure most of them do, but it's not the same as being able to whip out your phone inbetween classes to quickley show your friends-or during class to show a teacher.
Seems like alot of cell phone usage problems at schools could be fixed by NOT allowing them at schools and it would be A-OK with me. The Declaration didn't mention any inalienable rights in regards to bringing a cell phone to campus. I guess the Forefathers didn't see that one coming! Go figure.
Ladri.
05-21-2008, 04:09 PM
Allz I said is they aren't terrible and are nice to have. I pass no judgement on phones, except by how they assist me. Although I have a feeling I'm going to have cancer on my right thigh...as it vibrates even when my phone is not in my pocket. But, maybe I'm just suffering from "Phantom Phone". And I've also heard about all the bees dying because of phones!!!
Holy shit, that has started happening to my left leg. I read an article about it online.
I understand the bit about cyber bullying but it just bothers me they can look through personal belongings without permission.
It's no different than having your backpack confiscated and then riffled through.
Ladri.
05-21-2008, 04:30 PM
It's no different than having your backpack confiscated and then riffled through.
They aren't allowed to do that without probable cause such as a drug dog sniffed out your bookbag as I said before.
They aren't allowed to do that without probable cause such as a drug dog sniffed out your bookbag as I said before.
You said it yourself: "...probable cause..."
Quite the gray area, eh?
New Spark Films
05-21-2008, 04:32 PM
Allz I said is they aren't terrible and are nice to have. I pass no judgement on phones, except by how they assist me. Although I have a feeling I'm going to have cancer on my right thigh...as it vibrates even when my phone is not in my pocket. But, maybe I'm just suffering from "Phantom Phone". And I've also heard about all the bees dying because of phones!!!
That sounds eerily like what I've been having. Except recently I've been alternating from left to right leg, so either it'll reduce the risk of cancer... or I'll just get cancer on both legs.
Steve Nelson
05-21-2008, 04:47 PM
That sounds eerily like what I've been having. Except recently I've been alternating from left to right leg, so either it'll reduce the risk of cancer... or I'll just get cancer on both legs.
Haha. I found a few articles on it, here's one:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-06-12-cellphones_N.htm?csp=34
But most people blame it on psychological effects, as in someone who is obsessed with being called. But I could give two hoots about people calling me, I just have a cell phone because it's helpful in my life...so, I don't think it's that.
Ladri.
05-21-2008, 04:50 PM
Haha. I found a few articles on it, here's one:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-06-12-cellphones_N.htm?csp=34
But most people blame it on psychological effects, as in someone who is obsessed with being called. But I could give two hoots about people calling me, I just have a cell phone because it's helpful in my life...so, I don't think it's that.
I think it has to do with habitual actions. As for me, I will get a text message or two just around 7 in the morning every day and I thought I got one today but when I looked at my phone, no one had texted me.
Haha. I found a few articles on it, here's one:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-06-12-cellphones_N.htm?csp=34
It's a sign of the end-times.
I think it has to do with habitual actions. As for me, I will get a text message or two just around 7 in the morning every day and I thought I got one today but when I looked at my phone, no one had texted me.
LOL! I think that's called Behavioral Modification! You've been trained!
Ladri.
05-21-2008, 04:58 PM
LOL! I think that's called Behavioral Modification! You've been trained!
Well, pretty much. I'm just like Pavlov's dogs now. lol
Steve Nelson
05-21-2008, 05:03 PM
Well, pretty much. I'm just like Pavlov's dogs now. lol
I dunno, I read a comment on one of the articles from someone who said they had the same problem but never left their phone on vibrate. I also have never gotten calls at a specific time, routinely.
I don't completely trust cell phones, and seeing as they are so new, I wouldn't be surprised if they could cause health damage to us that we have yet to pick up on.
screamingdeathpunchpictures
05-21-2008, 06:37 PM
Well, pretty much. I'm just like Pavlov's dogs now. lol
Lol it's like a clockwork orange only I'm not vomitting and spazzing out when people call/text me.
screamingdeathpunchpictures
05-21-2008, 06:39 PM
I dunno, I read a comment on one of the articles from someone who said they had the same problem but never left their phone on vibrate. I also have never gotten calls at a specific time, routinely.
I don't completely trust cell phones, and seeing as they are so new, I wouldn't be surprised if they could cause health damage to us that we have yet to pick up on.
Oh god we're all going to become C.H.U.D.s!
luv4paintball
05-21-2008, 06:47 PM
the phone thing stinks, I say if they don't want it searched, then but it in the back pockets of the pants, they can't take it from there without you being able to call it sexual harassment. oh and the phantom phone thing seems to be on the rise overall, i don't have it, but then again, i have no cell phone so it would be extrememly odd if i had "phantom phone" symptoms.
ctvfilms
05-31-2008, 05:12 PM
haha cyber bullying
Ladri.
05-31-2008, 05:41 PM
Dude, seriously, you don't need to revive old threads like this.
AC Films
05-31-2008, 05:48 PM
i know it might be legal for principals to check peoples phone i school but what about this (because it has to do with outside life):
My friend's school will go and check people myspace page to see if anything bad is on there. And if anything is they will suspend you!
Ladri.
05-31-2008, 05:49 PM
i know it might be legal for principals to check peoples phone i school but what about this (because it has to do with outside life):
My friend's school will go and check people myspace page to see if anything bad is on there. And if anything is they will suspend you!
Now that right there is definitely illegal. They can't punish you for what you do in your own PERSONAL life. I would take that one up with the school board.
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